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Last Post 01/30/2013 9:13 PM by  Medulus
Why are Flod Claims so different
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paulvon
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01/05/2013 10:41 PM

    Let me start by saying that I know you have a hard job and I understand that.

    I am trying to understand why flood claims that have the same damage are treated so different.

    A row of five town houses are hit by 8 feet of water by Sandy.  The ceiling on the first floor is 8' 3" so it was missed.  The lowest level is slab on grade, it is garage and entrance.

    Two people who had the same flood coverage structure only are provided with documents showing damage of 6k at one place and 9k at another.

    In both cases the company is AllState.

    Why is the value 1/3 higher with one than the other?

    Thank you

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    DStin214
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    01/06/2013 8:05 PM
    Flood claims are different because the cause of loss is different than what is defined in a normal homeowners policy. Floor losses are caused by subterranean water that enters through the ground and/or walls. Flood water also comes from the ground and enters through doors, well windows or other openings. The key to identifying the difference is that the water comes from the ground and no the sky. Back up of sewer and drain is a different beast.

    To answer your question of "Why is the value 1/3 higher with one than the other?" I'm afraid there is no clear, specific answer for that. Differences can come from a variety of things. Such as: extent of damages between the two properties, different adjusters, adjuster experience, coverages between the two policies...etc. One of the properties may have different exclusions or endorsements on their insurance policy than the other. Because they are both insured through Allstate, that can rule out the "different insurance companies" variable. However, though personal experience, I have found Allstate to be less than desirable for claims and coverages. But that is just my own personal opinion.
    http://www.insurance-adjuster-help.com
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    Medulus
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    01/07/2013 7:39 AM
    Without having looked at both properties, no one can answer why your estimate and your neighbor's are different, but I will say that is the wrong question to ask. Neighbors comparing how much money they got is common, but not at all helpful to anyone. The real question is whether what you got was what you were entitled to under your policy. Only you and your adjuster can answer that question. It cannot be dealt with in a public forum. No one has access to the needed information to handle your claim, whether it be a National Flood Insurance Program (which is not an insurance policy but a government program) administered by Allstate or a sewer backup endorsement attached to an Allstate Homeowners Policy. Hate to tell you this, but no legitimate claim adjuster is going to use you neighbor's estimate to adjust your claim.
    Steve Ebner CPCU AIC AMIM

    "With great power comes great responsibility." (Stanley Martin Lieber, Amazing Fantasy # 15 August 1962)
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    Medulus
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    01/07/2013 7:39 AM
    Without having looked at both properties, no one can answer why your estimate and your neighbor's are different, but I will say that is the wrong question to ask. Neighbors comparing how much money they got is common, but not at all helpful to anyone. The real question is whether what you got was what you were entitled to under your policy. Only you and your adjuster can answer that question. It cannot be dealt with in a public forum. No one has access to the needed information to handle your claim, whether it be a National Flood Insurance Program (which is not an insurance policy but a government program) administered by Allstate or a sewer backup endorsement attached to an Allstate Homeowners Policy. Hate to tell you this, but no legitimate claim adjuster is going to use you neighbor's estimate to adjust your claim.
    Steve Ebner CPCU AIC AMIM

    "With great power comes great responsibility." (Stanley Martin Lieber, Amazing Fantasy # 15 August 1962)
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    pondman
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    01/07/2013 11:10 AM
    I just don't understand it.......BOTH my neighbors got NEW roofs? How come I am getting denied?......

    I appologize, but now back to your question. Steve and DStin214 are absolutely correct. NO two adjusters write estimates alike. Did the same adjuster do BOTH residences? This is one question that needs answering before you can EVEN begin to compare estimates. It's the ol preverbial apples to apples and oranges to oranges.

    Even with roofs, as I was expalining to wife of very good friend. They have policy with Major Carrier. Several neighbors roof got replaced. I explained that MAYBE some of those roofs shouldn't have been replaced, and upon re-inspection maybe those adjusters will not be around.

    But with flood questions, too many variables in how the estimate was written. This is so true as to when we reconcile estimates. Low and behold the clouds part and the sun beams down when both estimates are the same.
    Give them what they want, when they want it, and how they want it !
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    CatAdjusterX
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    01/07/2013 8:49 PM
    Posted By Sandy_Came on 05 Jan 2013 10:41 PM

    Let me start by saying that I know you have a hard job and I understand that.

    I am trying to understand why flood claims that have the same damage are treated so different.

    A row of five town houses are hit by 8 feet of water by Sandy.  The ceiling on the first floor is 8' 3" so it was missed.  The lowest level is slab on grade, it is garage and entrance.

    Two people who had the same flood coverage structure only are provided with documents showing damage of 6k at one place and 9k at another.

    In both cases the company is AllState.

    Why is the value 1/3 higher with one than the other?

    Thank you

    ...................................

    Even though these policies are being handled by Allstate, they are simply a WYO vendor administered through the NFIP (National Flood Insurance Program) Allstate does NOT establish flood guidelines, they adhere to the NFIP's mandates through the standard flood insurance policy and through memorandum's that amend the SFIP.

    Maybe two different adjusters will have two different conclusions but if they do someone is wrong, the ONLY true difference is building methods and materials used. Unless these are cookie cutter new single family townhouses, building material will vary and will vary greatly from one to another.

     If I have an 8'3 ceiling and an 8 foot interior water line, the ceiling is most certainly not missed and I will include R/Replace the ceilings as well. Super briefly, in regard to water lines, let's say we have a 18 inch (1 1/2 ft) water line, I am going to R/Replace 2 ft above said water line. In this example, that would be right at 3 1/2 ft. Well, it would prove more cost efficient to extend that 3 1/2 ft to 4 ft and as such I would R/Replace the drywall (interior/exterior and related components IE..Insulation/outlets/electrical) to 4 ft (with the reasoning almost all drywall comes in 32 sf sections 8ft x 4ft) Remember just because a water line is 8 ft or 1 ft or two ft, you "should " replace up to 2 ft above said water line.

    So with the 18 inch water line, I am going to write to replace to 4 ft and paint and texture to 8 ft

    (understand that I am only discussing the drywall related to the water line. Of course other building components will also be replaced IE... flooring/etc...)

    The point to that is maybe some flood certified adjusters will NOT write that specific damage the same way and as such variants will come into play and a pricing differential will exist....MAYBE

    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
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    CatAdjusterX
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    01/07/2013 8:55 PM
    Posted By Pondman on 07 Jan 2013 11:10 AM
    I just don't understand it.......BOTH my neighbors got NEW roofs? How come I am getting denied?......

    I appologize, but now back to your question. Steve and DStin214 are absolutely correct. NO two adjusters write estimates alike. Did the same adjuster do BOTH residences? This is one question that needs answering before you can EVEN begin to compare estimates. It's the ol preverbial apples to apples and oranges to oranges.

    Even with roofs, as I was expalining to wife of very good friend. They have policy with Major Carrier. Several neighbors roof got replaced. I explained that MAYBE some of those roofs shouldn't have been replaced, and upon re-inspection maybe those adjusters will not be around.

    But with flood questions, too many variables in how the estimate was written. This is so true as to when we reconcile estimates. Low and behold the clouds part and the sun beams down when both estimates are the same.

    .........................................

    Hey Pondscum   ehr, I mean Pondman, (JK, I promise) You appear to be new to posting here on CADO. Nevertheless from what you have posted so far, you appear to be pretty well versed, so welcome to the fray!! I look forward to reading future posts

    I always get frustrated when folks come atcha with well so and so down the street got x amount of money with  half the damage that I have!! Ugh!!

    That is all, have a great day!

    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
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    ChuckDeaton
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    01/08/2013 5:40 PM
    I hate to answer a question with a question, but, what is the problem, I serious, what is the problem? Is your scope wrong? I mean were damaged items left out? Provide details and one of the experienced flood adjusters who post here may give you a helpful and correct answer.
    "Prattling on and on about being an ass with experience doesn't make someone experienced. It just makes you an ass." Rod Buvens, Pilot grunt
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    CatAdjusterX
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    01/09/2013 12:21 AM
    Posted By ChuckDeaton on 08 Jan 2013 05:40 PM
    I hate to answer a question with a question, but, what is the problem, I serious, what is the problem? Is your scope wrong? I mean were damaged items left out? Provide details and one of the experienced flood adjusters who post here may give you a helpful and correct answer.

    ....................................

    Chuck, seems to me the question has ALREADY been answered. Not my response, actually the answer lies within the poster's text itself.

    A breakdown of the damaged components to be removed/replaced or removed/repaired and a dollar amount to do so is required to be submitted to said insured. The poster states they have BOTH documents, and they should explain WHY the amounts are different. NOBODY receives a piece of paper stating ," your getting 6,000.00 for repairs, now F**K off !!" (well, except TWIA insureds (LOL))

    "A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
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    Atfulldraw
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    01/09/2013 1:35 AM
    Posted By CatAdjusterX on 09 Jan 2013 12:21 AM
    Posted By ChuckDeaton on 08 Jan 2013 05:40 PM
    I hate to answer a question with a question, but, what is the problem, I serious, what is the problem? Is your scope wrong? I mean were damaged items left out? Provide details and one of the experienced flood adjusters who post here may give you a helpful and correct answer.

    ....................................

    Chuck, seems to me the question has ALREADY been answered. Not my response, actually the answer lies within the poster's text itself.

    A breakdown of the damaged components to be removed/replaced or removed/repaired and a dollar amount to do so is required to be submitted to said insured. The poster states they have BOTH documents, and they should explain WHY the amounts are different. NOBODY receives a piece of paper stating ," your getting 6,000.00 for repairs, now F**K off !!" (well, except TWIA insureds (LOL))


    This is patently false.  

    No one got $6,000 from TWIA.  Not even the adjusters. :)

    Rod
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    ChuckDeaton
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    01/26/2013 11:42 PM
    I once said that anyone who would work for TWIA is a "worm", then I apologized, now I wonder if my apology was premature.
    "Prattling on and on about being an ass with experience doesn't make someone experienced. It just makes you an ass." Rod Buvens, Pilot grunt
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    okclarryd
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    01/30/2013 7:36 PM
    Actually, from the guy in the parking lot at Appleby's,........................they prefer "warm worms".
    Larry D Hardin
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    Medulus
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    01/30/2013 9:13 PM
    I saw him wandering around 86th street Manhattan a couple weeks ago. The Appleby's there didn't have a parking lot, so he couldn't figure out where to hang out.
    Steve Ebner CPCU AIC AMIM

    "With great power comes great responsibility." (Stanley Martin Lieber, Amazing Fantasy # 15 August 1962)
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