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Posted By PSR on 17 Jan 2010 03:59 PM
When I was a staff adjuster, within the last two years, I started out at 47K, along with a car and great benefits, with no experience. Like I said up thread, the training was great and I worked a ton of claims, but I didn't want to deal with the day to day office politics that went along with it. Getting hooked up with Pilot and Eberl has been a Godsend, and having a mentor who has been through all this has been even better.

Yeah, i worked for Pilot, they are good, but almost all work comes from Allstate, which is a terrible company for an IA (NextGEn +integriclaim=nightmare).

Posted By sbeau4014 on 17 Jan 2010 03:44 PM

Anyway Olegred, in answer to the original question I am too far out of the loop of staff at the entry level to give an indication on the starting salary levels. To make the 6 figure amount you would have to be a GA or claim manager, which won't happen in the 1st 5 years at least in a staff job.  I don't know your experience level in claims adjusting, but I got the impression from one of your posts that you haven't been doing it for a real long time.  Going to a staff job for you may be almost the same as them hiring an unexperienced person as you would most likely have to go through the same training that they would put new hires through.  Although you know how to scope and write estimates on exactimate, do you know auto, GL, WC claims work?  A lot of staff jobs require a multiline claims knowledge, although I can't speak for a staff cat job.

I've spend about 17 years as a staffy and about 13-14 as IA and there are huge +'s and -"s for both.  Based on what you have written, I'd stay an independent if I were you as I don't think you will see the $$ you want on the staff side in the near future.  I've been wrong before, and will be wrong again though, so who knows.

Man, that's a lot of experience you have, jesus. Well, no, I have not done any auto, GL or WC claims. I am planning to stick with property, get some more experience with flood, then move to more complex losses, including commercial, time element.

olegred this will really start a word war, but hard times will hit and you will not be needed by any insurance company as a catastrophe adjuster or an IA working overflow unless you have lots of staff experience like Steve and many other posters.

New ways of working property claims have been here or years like preferred contractors, but they can not do cat claims as the volume would overwhelm ever contractor in the US. Thats why they have cat adjusters, clean up crews, and defense lawyers.

Measurments and photos are the easy part. Millions of people all around the world can use xactimate. People who can scope from notes and photo,s abound. All the carriers need on any type property loss is people who can count and basic computer skills. More to come.....hope this does not take the wind out of the room.

Posted By Olegred on 17 Jan 2010 04:57 PM
As for contractors taking over, it's not gonna happen. First, they are biased, second, not enough experience, unreliable and so forth. And finally, they lack company's infrastructure, which means that carrier still have to do lots to close the file.

This shows the lack of experience by this person. Talk to a lot of IA's out there and from daily claims to cat times many carriers are now requiring the roof be measured, pitch shown and shingle gauge used for thickness. Even if there is no roof claim they are requiring this. Why? Because when the carrier has all of this and a windstorm occurs, the staff adjuster can then call the satalite provider to send real time shots of the roof to verify the damage. Then the estimate can be writted at a desk. The only time a need for an IA will be when the hail damage cannot be seen from the satalite or the shingles have laid back down and the insured demands a human inspection. Even then, it will be possible that a Direct Repair contractor will be called out.

The comments that olegred made about contractors can be true in some instances but to blanket all contractors with this brush is inappropriate, untrue and uncalled for. There are many above board contractors who can do circles around him and go down the road while he is still wondering where he is. Many carriers are going this route and have been doing so for some time. Why do you think that the employment of P&C adjusters for staff positions was down 13% for 2009? Carriers are using the DRP to save expenses.

If olegred's attitude is indicative of the new breed of  2010 appraisers (less than 5 years), then I will say a prayer for the carriers.

Sadly, I have seen this same attitude croping up in other sites and when working storms and day claims as well.

Maybe Willie Nelson is right when he said to turn out the lights, the parties over.

 

BobH said on 17 Jan 2010
This thread started on the concept of "joining staff". If most of your work has been limited assignments, you may find you have to "downshift" a few times to keep the engine from stalling when you join staff at an Insurance company (or take on Full Assignments & General Liability claims at a large IA).

Olegred said on 17 Jan 2010
What to you mean? Like take it easy? I am so used to being as "claim closed" oriented as possble, that I may find it difficult. :)

Besides, to transact insurance business you have to be licensed and they are not.

Staff adjusters

Can't climb roofs, can't see damage. Helpless.

Posted By BobH on 17 Jan 2010 11:46 PM

Besides, to transact insurance business you have to be licensed and they are not.

Actually a contractor does NOT have to be licensed as an adjuster to be the "eyes and ears" for the carrier that has a staff person who "adjusts" the claim and concludes the settlement.

What Rocke said in the prior post is true, and it has been going on for a while. Check out the contractor-connection aspect of Crawford's web site

Nonetheless, I personally believe you will do fine. I am not one of the people knocking what you are doing or plans for continued success, I think you will do OK.

From what I hear, CC is not doing too great :)

Posted By BobH on 17 Jan 2010 11:46 PM

Besides, to transact insurance business you have to be licensed and they are not.

Actually a contractor does NOT have to be licensed as an adjuster to be the "eyes and ears" for the carrier that has a staff person who "adjusts" the claim and concludes the settlement.

What Rocke said in the prior post is true, and it has been going on for a while. Check out the contractor-connection aspect of Crawford's web site

Nonetheless, I personally believe you will do fine. I am not one of the people knocking what you are doing or plans for continued success, I think you will do OK.

Well, in that case they can not discuss the scope with the insured and so forth... :) 

Good adjusters will always  be needed on catastrophe losses. Take any city of over 100 k people and you can find enough "moon lighters" in local government job, fireman, police men, school teachers, shift workers, college students to act a roof inspectors, inside inspectors, photo takers that can be trained in 3 days to do that job and send the scope sheets, diagrams, photos by email & wireless computer to the estimatics center and all the inspections done that day will submitted with an agreed settlement amount by noon the next day. The inspectors will make $25.00 per house and $75.00 per day auto expense. The xactimate operators will make $25.00 per hour and work around the clock from any place in the world. Fifteen  good adjusters will be needed to oversee 1,000 closed losses per day (agreed settlement). Traveling inspectors will get $100.00 per deim each day worked. About 15 FICUS will need to travel and the rest can be trained on site at the rate of 40-50 per week. The present flood fee bill would be great, but this will drive down all IA fee bills to some unit price for each roof, room, contents list etc.xactimate has a unit price for everything and inspections are the next step.

Posted By JHartMo on 18 Jan 2010 10:46 AM
Olegred, I think your attitude toward this profession stinks, and I would bet I'm not the only one who thinks that after reading your posts. This is a very people oriented job and many of us take pride and satisfaction in helping people while we are trying to make an honest living. I don't fault you for wanting to make as much as you can to support yourself, but the attitude you seem to have about yourself as compared with others leads me to believe you think higher of yourself than you ought to. I read one of your posts that stated you have been doing this since August of '08, and that you are flood certified. The minimum requirements for certification are 4 years of full time adjusting. Hmm, what ethical standards do you observe in regards to this industry. If I was interviewing you for a staff job, that would be a huge red flag for me. Character counts, it's the only thing you have that can't be taken away.

Very will said. Of course we all have to have confidence in ourselves to survive this business, but to pound one's chest like a gorilla only infers your of the jungle. I suggest to anyone who wishes to pound their own chest, that they beware of the future. It may be bleak.

This is an excerpt from an article I found when I "googled"  "What is a Professional"

In addition to Ability, Confidence, Responsibility, Belief and Respect other key personal qualities that define a Professional are Honour, Reputation and Trustworthiness. Trustworthiness comes from an assurance of reliability. Reputation is not only a signal to your customers but also a commitment mechanism that keeps you up to the mark. Paul Seabright, a British economist working at the University of Toulouse has written, "Those who can convince others of their intrinsic honesty, may thereby prosper, and it may be easier for the genuinely honest to be thus convincing—the more so if honesty, or at least the true and honorable performance of a certain trade or skill, requires a degree of style, confidence and even grace, built up over a long period of commitment to the task, that are hard for an opportunist to feign."

There's a lot of wisdom there, certainly words worthy of considering.