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Its unfortunate you have had that experience.......

AG, What most folks don't understand, is the company wants and needs adjusters not trainees. Its not SF's place to train people during the cat. I'll bet the vendor assigned you as an experienced adjuster. If your serious about the business, hang in there. It'll get easier.

JWG

If I read it right, AG...they didn't totally jerk the rug out from under your feet.  You still get to finish the claims you inspected and get paid on them.  Maybe, just maybe, this was just a little wake-up call.  Put aside all disappointments (hard as that may be), and put forth a damn good finished product.  It's too bad that you're lacking in some side-car help, but from reading your post you seem like an intelligent individual.  Did they give you any sample files to follow?  My suggestion would be to follow those, or politely ask them to give you some.  Go from there.  It may pay off.    

This is a sad but frequent experience. I am in Cincinnati working and you cannot believe what I have overheard insureds being told regarding their damages or coverages. To make it worse, people in this area are unaccustomed to any hardships in their lives therefore those with a few missing shingles think this is the end of the world. I blame the vendors for putting these new but unexperienced warm bodies on the street with little or no training. I guess its just the gladiator mentality - see who is the last man standing. It's just not fair to the new folks and it's certainly not fair to the policyholders. New folks should at minimum be put in the call centers where at least they will have constant supervision. I agree with Larry, to be a professional in this business takes years of training both classroom and on the job and you still are continuously learning. I would suggest that those of you out there on your first cat use this forum and that of Claims Mentor to search for answers in your spare time, yeah right. Good luck to all of you and be careful out there.

Again its unfortunate that you had this experience

I would like to ask about the mentoring,, training and "time" that you suggest it would take for someone to train you. This is just for discussion so don't take it as discouragement. Why would a company invest in an experienced person and spend the dollars to train a subcontractor who may bolt the minute he/she is trained?

It has been said many many times, that any potential CAT adjusters should seek out , beg plead what ever it takes to find an experienced guy to let you trade whatever it is you can offer to be able to ride with and observe.

The people that have asked me to allow them to come to a storm with me, ALL wanted me either to pay them, or hook them up with claims. Basically they wanted me to lose money training a competitor.

I also get offended that everyone thinks an average JOE can do this. I think too many Average Joes go home flat broke or in debt to say that is an accurate statement.

There are 2 things Cat adjusters must learn.

1) Being an adjuster
2) How to make money being an adjuster

Thank the good lord above, 5 years ago I had very experienced guys that hammered me hard, didn't pay me, would only answer my questions AFTER I tried to find out my own answer. or tell me where to look for an answer. Then, only after I proved that I could be an adjuster, they started sharing with me the tips, tricks etc. that make the difference between an adjuster that can wirte a claim and an a cat adjuster that can make money.

Good luck and its all up to you .

Swink,
Sounds like you had some "mentoring" along the way. Simply based on his post, it is obvious (at least to me) that Adjuster TN is not the "average Joe". Over the last several years on this very website, I have made the the very same case that you make: why would I want to help someone compete with me for work? Well, I don't. However, we need to realize that our profession is dependent upon our collective reputation. Therein, we need to welcome, encourage and help those who demonstrate the ethics and values which are requisite to become a good adjuster. Whether you like it, I like it or anyone else likes it, Adjuster TN will become a very good cat adjuster. He has the right stuff. There is absolutely no reason to be concerned about competition with Adjuster TN, he can't hold a candle to that which we do. However, with his attitude, a little perseverence and a smidgen of "mentoring", he will become a success in this business. That is not competition, it is instead, affirmation of that which we do. His inevitable success in this field will make all of us look better.

I don't disagree with anything that has been said on this thread

My post was solely for discussion. I do not feel very many of the IA firms are gonna go out of their way to pay trainees, nor do I think many IAs are gonna pay to train someone.

That doesn't mean that they wouldn't be willing to train or mentor

I could post up a long-winded response but I'll just cut to the chase. Handling hurricane claims for Big Red is THE LAST place you need to be if you are just getting into the business. There is way too much information to process and you're simply setting yourself up to fail. You would be much better off starting out and working for a carrier that simply requires you to scope the loss and write an estimate only. There will be a lot less pressure and you will no doubt get a much better feel for working claims.

A.G.,

After five years working for State Farm as an auto adjuster (but also part of their CAT team) and two years at Nationwide, I set off to become an independent CAT adjuster. That was 1998. The CAT vendors who worked for State Farm wanted to use me because I had State Farm experience as an employee. That didn't neccessarily make it easier. In fact, it turns out that my State Farm supervisor had blackballed me when I told him I was leaving and wanted to become an independent. Even though I didn't actually go independent for two years after that, the blackball eventually led to being cut from the State Farm independent work (it was at least the second best thing I could have done business-wise). Since the right hand doesn't always know what the left hand is doing at the farm, though, I ended up getting State Farm work as an independent through most of 1998. I am familiar with the extensive log notes. Those procedures and the incessant meetings mean your income will be about 33% less than when you work for another carrier. The standards and pricing can change from day to day with State Farm. That means you may turn in files that are 100% correct when you turn them in. But by the time the "supervisor" reviews them, they will be incorrect and you will have to redo them. Back in the days I handled State Farm work, every estimate needed a dictated letter. By the time the steno pool got to your letter and got it to you (with typos you had to send back for correction and wait for the correction) you would be fielding three or four phone calls from the insured wondering where their money was. I could go on and on, but I have my own work, and it is waiting. I am now something of a claims examiner and independent s are probably cursing me even as I write this.

Suffice it to say, that I think you made a start. Do not be discouraged by a negative response from the Farm. They are not the only game in town. They are not the most profitable game in town. They do not value independents. They see them as a neccessary evil. The "supervisors" are often line claim reps or auto supervisors who got tired of sitting at their desk back in their home office and decided to join the CAT team. Soometimes they know less than you do. Some of them wouldn't know what to call you on if Xactimate didn't put an asterisk on the item every time you changed a price or a description of an item. Doing work for the Farm will inform your future work. Of this there is no doubt. But their judgement is not the be-all and end-all of the industry. Their "trainers" often are fresh out of claim school. I sometimes had to explain coverage to them. They often know even less about construction. And they are on salary plus bonus with all their expenses paid. They are not motivated to the same extent as you are. Therefore, they have no problem standing around joking with each other while you are hoping for a scrap of their time to get a question answered.

And that, my friend, is the other side of the coin. If this business is your passion, keep with it. You may even work for the Farm again. But next time you will be able to hit the ground running. My advice is to run circles around them. It really isn't that hard. It just takes a little experience behind you. You have now had one such experience.

Steve E.,
Your post to A.G. was dead on the mark. Having worked as an independent adjuster with a vendor for State Farm (and handling their cat claims) for nearly five years, I can attest to everything you said in that post. Based on the information provided, we can reasonably deduce that A.G. got thrown under the State Farm Motor Home with the Good Neighbor signs prominently displayed. Perhaps the Good Neighbor philosophy is for advertising purposes only. Perhaps however, we do not have all of the information. We all understand there are usually two sides to any story and I would love to hear the State Farm version of this. I shall await patiently to hear the other side of this story. I suspect "patienly" will be the key word in the last sentence.

And Steve, you are absolutely correct, they are not the only game in town. They may be the biggest, but that doesn't mean they will remain that way. If they are as ruthless as this thread portrays, they will eventually fall from grace. I think A.G. has posted an experience which identifies a very disturbing trait with this carrier, but as I said earlier, I would love to hear their side of this.

Surely some State Farmers perceive this as a negative thread. Based on what I have read, there is nothing negative about State Farm Insurance Company, unless they want to own it. There was simply a post about the dissapointment experienced by a beginner adjuster who was led down a wrongful path by someone other than State Farm, I.E. one of their contractors. If this scenario is accurate, as A.G portrays, then State Farm should either accept responsibility for harboring/encouraging and condoning such misleading, hurtful and devastating practices or they should take charge of this issue and demand appropriate changes within their contractor cadre. Either State Farm is complicit in the warm bodies mentality regarding the staffing of the initial stages of their catastrophy operations or they are not. Which is it?

Posted By Unknown Adjuster on 17 Oct 2008 05:11 PM

I just did my very first CAT Assignment, and it went all downhill right from the start... 

 

...I'm new to the industry, new to adjusting. 

 

... my claims started backing up. 

 

...Now I'm being released from my assignment, a mere 3 1/2 weeks after starting this.  Had my remaining uninspected claims yanked off me, and was told to follow all my remaining claims to conclusion/payment, and that I would be released from assignment. 

 

I definitely don't feel like I've been given a fair shake.  I feel like I'm being ran off, so i can be someone else's problem, when if I could spend about 2 - 3 good weeks with a darn trainer, and get some sort of workflow system down and learn how to do a claim from start to finish, that I would be a more effective and proficient adjuster in the field and in the office.  The reason I'm being given as for my release has been that I didn't meet some 80% closing to inspected ratio, which until Tuesday afternoon I hadn't heard so much as a whisper of.  a complex job like adjusting.

 

Had my remaining uninspected claims yanked off me

They did that so you could actually wrap up the ones you started, but didn't finish.  They were doing you, and the "not yet inspected" policy holders a favor. State Farm's commitment is to their policyholder, not to the professional they hire to look at the policyholder's house.  Another professional adjuster could be looking at your uninspected losses while you focus on the ones you started. 

 

That "inspected to closed" ratio is management's insight to identifying people who are not keeping up with closing the losses they inspected.  Management isn't evil, they are just trying to get what they paid for.  You were deployed to Ohio where they have a statute re: STANDARDS FOR PROMPT, FAIR AND EQUITABLE SETTLEMENT OF CLAIMS UNDER FIRE     AND EXTENDED COVERAGE INSURANCE POLICIES  

 

Adjusters deployed to Texas are working under tighter guidelines:

TIMEFRAMES FOR CLAIM PROCESSING AND PAYMENT.  When you file a claim on your own policy, you have the right to have your claim processed and paid promptly.  If the insurance company fails to meet required claims processing and payment deadlines, you have the right to collect 18% annual interest and attorney's fees in addition to your claim amount.  http://www.tdi.state.tx.us/rules/bor-home-english.html 

If they thought you were totally incompetent they would have simply released you without even letting you write up the ones you already inspected.

 

Rather than finding fault with State Farm, be thankful for the learning experience. Understand that if you were more experienced, they would have kept you on - and at least let you finish all the files initially give to you.  You have a great attitude, and should do well if you stay in the profession.

 

I had 15 years property adjusting experience when I worked my first storm with State Farm - and I did not have an easy time. They did teach me things I didn't know.  Their system has streamlined since the time my friend Steve Ebner worked with State Farm, I rarely do dictation.  This is not their first rodeo, and their activity log notes etc, are not overkill in my opinion. 

 

If you work claims long enough, you will see litigation.  Any good carrier will want properly documented claim files that show when someone was contacted, did you respond in a timely manner to documents submitted, how was the claim value determined, were Replacement Cost Benefits explained, etc.  The system is there for a reason. 

Most carriers do something similar, and I have worked for many, many carriers.  With most states adopting some version of "fair claim practices" the file documentation has got to communicate.  It can be concise, but has to have the important facts as the claim progresses. 

Posted By Rob Banks on 27 Oct 2008 11:06 PM
...Handling hurricane claims for Big Red is THE LAST place you need to be if you are just getting into the business. There is way too much information to process and you're simply setting yourself up to fail. You would be much better off starting out and working for a carrier that simply requires you to scope the loss and write an estimate only.
There will be a lot less pressure and you will no doubt get a much better feel for working claims.

AdjusterTN, good and bad experiences are teachers, if you choose to learn from them. I like your attitude and wish that I had had the opportunity to work with you. If you continue on this venture, call Bill Slove at Cunningham Lindsey, 1-800-998-5741 and ask to get on their program. It may be possible for you to go to Vale Tech for training with a commitment to them for several years. If you have any questions, PM me.

I had a similar experience when i was switched from a carrier i had worked with extensively, to a new carrier with slightly different guidelines ---- (different policies, different expectations, etc.) ---- it was he--- at first, but it got better (i'm already home though)