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Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
 Posted - 10/16/2003 : 17:36:04
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Catdaddy, remember the day you got hosed by Ol'Dragons Breath? Well, good buddy, I tanked up the gas and it's your turn at the trigger.
Enjoy! |
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fivedaily
USA
258 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 19:01:58
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Brooks, If you don't want the job, why make a bid at all? Just tell the homeowner you are not interested. Seems that would save EVERYONE (you, homeowner, insurance co.) unnecessary headaches.
I have only been on the insurance side of the equation. I can't make sense of writing a bid for a job you don't want. Can someone enlighten me?
Jnnifer |
Edited by - fivedaily on 10/16/2003 19:03:42 |
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CatDaddy
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 19:29:50
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I remember that day well GB. I've had to have 3 skin grafts and some of my hair still hasn’t grown back.
Can you believe this guy? You know these guys are out there; you look for them when you're working but they are hard to see....then the idiot of the whole village comes walking right up to you. Then he opens his mouth, and confirms every suspicion you ever had about the whole stink'n lot. Mark this one off you list boys. We were right.
BLT, you’re too stupid to realize every word in every post you make shows us all just how much you don’t know and what you really are. It’s like looking a train wreck. We can’t look away. Jacking up your prices, granule damage, expanding tile damage? And you ask us if we are communist.
Do us all a favor and head back over to the RoofingContractors.com Mutual Admiration Society and share your intellect with them. From what I have seen of you so far, they might elect you their King. You’re all a waste of skin.
By the way, taking yourself to McDonalds for nuggets in your flatbed with no air, then heading back home to put lipstick and mascara on your right hand doesn’t make it sex. Better luck next time.
I’ll buy the gas next time Ghost. Thanks.
CD
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Edited by - CatDaddy on 10/16/2003 19:30:56 |
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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 19:38:08
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Brooks, you say you have never done a project that you bid high. While I find that hard to believe, what would you do if you bid a simple 5/12, 3 tab roof at $250 a square and the homeowner, not knowing any better and trusting you to be an honest man as you state that you are, says "Can you start tomorrow?" Do you A. Say "Well, you look like an honest guy. I'll do it for half that, B. Look at the bid again and say, "Hey, wait a minute, I over bid this, let me fix that for you, now that looks alot better now doesn't it?" or C. Do the job for the price quoted and laugh about the stupid customer you just screwed with your buddies over a beer the next day.
I think we all know the answer. |
Edited by - KileAnderson on 10/16/2003 19:39:46 |
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Brooks Todd
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 10/16/2003 : 23:45:58
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Lets see what you got boys:
Kile - I have some respect for you, because I started laying on the roofs and looking at them. You are right, the damage, or none shows better. At least I also know you are fit enough to do that manuever. I would never charge that much ($350). For a problem child on a 3-tab with no steep, it would be $110 on & off.Any other roofer around D/FW would do it for $100, or less.
Cat - I don't know how to respond to you, but also you read things like you want to. I don't know what makes you such an expert, except that you are a decent writer. How many hail damaged roofs do you have to see to be an expert? I think after about 10.
As always I have enjoyed
BLT |
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Brooks Todd
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 00:02:35
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Jennifer:
If there is damage at an insureds prroperty, our policy is to give a proposal. It really infuriates people when you offer tham a no bid. We have never had a BB complaint, and don't wan't one.
Cat - Stupid?
BLT |
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Brooks Todd
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 00:58:32
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Cat Daddy:
After having some time to wind down and think it over, I don't see how you have explained anything, except that you are the stupid 1 here, you have not supported any argument you have except for calling me stupid & the village idiot. Obviously you did not read Hillary's book.
Write all the checks you like, or not. What sets pricing guidelines in construction, is material cost, labor, and profit. Not some know it all adjuster. New construction is the guideline of the industry, not some catastrophic damage. How much new building is going on in Louisiana?
BLT |
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Tom Toll
USA
154 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 07:22:42
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There are good and bad on both sides. Roofers that gouge and adjusters who write what is not there to increase their revenue. When we arrived in V.B., I called five roofers to get an idea of pricing. Four were giving decent prices and one was 25% higher, explaining that he was the best in town. He offered to pick us up in his limo and show us the town. Needless to say, I politely told him where to put his limo and prices.
On the other hand, there was an adjuster that totaled a roof with four missing tabs. A roof that was 5 years old, still pliable with 90% of orignal granulation intact. No lifting or breaking. The difference in estimates, over $4,000.00.
It behooves all of us to learn as much as we can about roofing and the damage it sustains in any type of catastophe. Natural deterioration is not a covered loss, but catastrophic damage is. We need to know the difference, and I for one appreciate roofers posting here, as their view may better serve us down the road.
I grow concerned about this industry that I have been a part of almost 44 years. I see the insurance industry trying to set prices and then the roofers trying to set prices, leaving the adjuster in the middle. Low schedules invite exaggeration of loss, so now the adjuster must depend on volume of claim count and not quality. I fear I am from the old school, if it is not there, don't pay it, but if it is there, pay everything the insured is entitled to.
This is one reason we need an adjusters organization, so these issues can be addressed and resolved. Are we seeing an interest in an organization, NO, just grumbling and negativity about our industry and the construction industry. I have always felt that if we cannot make a decent living in this industry and be professional and honest, then we need to look for another trade. I love this trade and would not leave it for anything. It is a pain in the tuckus, but it is also rewarding with a job well done. Consider this, SOPPA-Society of Professional Property Adjusters. It would work!! |
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CCarr
Canada
1200 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 07:53:55
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Tom, I've seen a few times now in the last month or so where you have spoken affirmatively about some kind of adjuster organization; while at the same time commenting that any such discussion is going nowhere but that it 'could' work.
I would welcome any thoughts you might have concerning how to get this idea moving forward, and any details on how it 'would' work to the benefits of its members.
I've got a headache from beating the same tune for too many months, damn, I can't even get people to participate in a survey about those "low schedules" you mention. |
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Brooks Todd
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 09:05:52
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Greetings :
Finally some legitimate responses.
We can all learn from one another. Not just roofing, but from the slab up. Also common courtesy.
For real Tom, did a poor ole roofer offer you a ride in his limo. If that is true, thats one great story. That gives me some hope. According to Catdaddy roofers drive old beat up flat beds. And eat chicken mcnuggets. Whats a mcnugget? |
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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 09:21:03
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Brooks,
If you and your roofing friends are doing roofs for $110/sq in DFW you must be an honest enough guy. Here in the backwater of Paducah, KY they want anywhere from $120 to $150/sq. But of course it is alot harder to find the type of labor pool you have in DFW. Those guys can really put on a roof.
As far as being an expert on hail after 10 roofs, well, I've been chasing storms for 5 years and have looked at I would guess in excess of 3000 roofs on hail claims and I'd have to say I'm still not an expert. Every storm is different and every roof is different. I know things are bigger in Texas, even the hail stones. Here in KY the hail was anywhere from tennis ball sized down to almost sleet. It isn't easy to explain to a homeowner that even though the metal vents have BB sized dents on them there is no damage to the roof. It's even more difficult to explain to people that the reason the guy across the street got a new roof is because he was negligent in the maintenance of his property and his roof was paper thin so any sized hail at all would damage it so he's getting a new roof and you're not.
Some hail is big and hard and does really good damage. Some hail is big and soft and doesn't do much or any damage. Some hail is small and hard and you can't see the damage unless you get on your knees and look for it. I don't think anyone can ever be a true expert in this field, but every roof gives you that much more experience. |
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CatDaddy
USA
310 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 10:33:50
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TT, isnt CADO a type of adjuster's organization? We all talk about every aspect of the industry here. And I am sure people are more open with their ideas on CADO than in a room looking all of you in the eye.
Now if you are talking about something more like a union, with union ideas, and trying to throw some weight around, that's something different. And probably the end of the job you love so well.
Just my thoughts.
Brooks, I have no comments. A story of a roofer with a limo says it all. Doctors drive Tahoes. Roofers have limos. That kinda says it all.
Hopefully our paths will cross one day. I have added it to my wish list.
CD |
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Brooks Todd
USA
43 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 16:14:49
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Yeah that thing where the neighbor gets a roof, but the other guy doesn't is tough. This 1 home had giant oak trees all around it, 30 year roof, and a 10&12. This lady was pissed that I told her she had no damage. (remember i'm the roofer) We were on the house across the street a 6&12, 30 year, and completely in the open it was hammered. I vow to you that I crawled all over that ladies house and couldn't find damage. She called another contractor out ( 1 of them that gives us a bad name), and somehow he got her a new roof. I also think the brand of shingles makes a difference. GAF & Elk seem to hold up the best.
In D/FW storm this year some of the adjusters I ran into were inexperienced, and didn't like crawling on steep roofs. Could they have possibly signed off without really looking at the roof.
Cat - Peace man. My plans are to become a staff adjuster here in D/FW, learn the business and software. Also let my daughter get a little older, so she can understand why I am gone so much, and then do what y'all do.
We will surely meet somewhere. When we do we will take my limo with the roofer signs on the door, and go for food & drinks.
Have a good weekend, it is beautiful here
BLT |
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Tom Toll
USA
154 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 16:46:18
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| Cat, yes CADO is an organization of fellow adjusters. Look at the convention. Not enough interest to even have one next year. If we cannot organize, then we can set up a Society of Professional Property Adjusters and have separate state memberships, just like state adjuster organizations. I have been a member of The International Society of Air Saftey Investigators for many years. It is a very professional organization with stringent requirements. All the Aviation companies know that if they retain an ISASI member, they have the best available. It took me years to get into that organization, but was well worth the effort. That is the type of organization I would like to see and I feel one that would be beneficial to all concerned. One that the companies know that when they see that credential, they can expect Professionalism, Character, and Integrity. |
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khromas
USA
103 Posts |
Posted - 10/17/2003 : 17:47:25
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I officially declare a 'cease-fire' in the negative direction this forum topic has generated.
It does no one any good to trade insults or accusations of incompetance and degrades the spirit of professionalism we all (SHOULD) try to ascribe to.
The principle of free exchange of ideas and speech is that each and every person has a right to their own opinion and I will defend to the death that person's right to disagree.
(Paraphrased from a well known document!)
Tom - I look forward to sitting down with you and Janice on Sunday and discussing positive moves we can make in establishing a plan for developing standards of professionalism and organization, hopefully here through CADO. I think the scope of the associations should not be limited to just property adjusters but those that cover all the spectrums - casualty, auto, medical, etc. There may be the need for seperate sub-divisions for the various specialties but the major carriers are looking at the broad picture. |
Kevin Hromas |
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