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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
 Posted - 02/01/2004 : 12:19:46
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Republicans do not ignore the poor. GW has increased domestic spending more than any of his predecessors, much to my disapointment. Why does the "working class" want the Republicans to pay attention to them. My goal is to get my government to pay as little attention to me as possible. It is not the government's job to feed and clothe people, show me in the constitution where it says that. You can't, because it doesn't. The government's job is to pave the roads, enforce the laws and protect the borders. That's it. This pathetic wellfare state we have created has created an entire class of dependents who do not seem to think that they are responsible for their own welfare and they don't know any better because it is all they have ever known.
If you go back to the genesis of this thread, my statement was that poverty as it is HISTORICALY known and as it is known in most countries around the world does not exist in this country. We don't have entire villages full of children with distended bellies too week to shoo the flies off of their faces.
I never said get rid of charities. I think we need more charities and if we didn't pay so much in taxes we could all give alot more to charities and they would manage the money alot better than the government does.
I know exactly how Bill Gates got to be where he is. Smarts, hard work, good timing, a vision nobody else saw, and a great deal of luck. He had a product that he knew would reveloutionize an industry that he saw would explode. IBM didn't see it that way. They thought they were taking advantage of this skinny little geek. They wanted to buy MS Dos from him, he said, no I don't want to sell it to you, I'll just license it to you. IBM thought he was an idiot because they were getting what they wanted for what they thought was a fraction of what they were willing to pay. Now who's laughing.
Our country gives $200 Billion to charities every year. That is money from the public, not the government. I am whole heartedly behind giving to charity. I do it and I encourage others to do it, and I am a Republican.
One thing that I have learned is that most people, be they elephants, donkeys or other, are 95% the same. They all care about family, safety, freedom and are willing to help others. We may differ in our vision of this country and the direction it should be going, but it is a difference of 5 or 10 degrees when you boil it all down, not the 180 degrees that the politicians and political parties would have you believe.
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JimF
USA
1014 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 12:40:29
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Kile if you would stop reacting defensively to each poster who doesn't see things the way you do, and sit back and LISTEN, you might learn something about a subject you know NOTHING about.
When you have handed out sandwiches to the homeless on urban streets like Clayton has, or worked in a food kitchen for the poor like OlderThenDirt has, or helped to solicit food for a food bank like I have, then, and only then will anyone here take your views on poverty seriously.
In the meantime, if you can't listen, then ride around with your tinted windows and your eyes wide shut, and let the rest of us do something about a very real problem in America.
You're simply out of touch with the reality of poverty in this country and you will never learn the truth by simply listening to Rush Limbaugh's rantings and ravings or from the politicians either. Their eyes are wide shut to the realities as well.
If you want to see the real visceral poverty in America, then come out here and visit and follow along with those of us who live and travel in the real world of a divided America of haves and have-nots.
What everyone here is trying to get across to you, is that on the subject of poverty in America, you are showing your ignorance. You are the only person on this planet who can do anything to change your ignorance on the subject, and you can only do that by listening. Not by talking or arguing from a narrowly clouded point of view.
No one here is trying to beat you up. We are only trying to help you see the path to enlightenment in your journey to growth and understanding. Don't take that as an personal assault but rather as a blessing that your friends care enough to bother. |
Edited by - JimF on 02/01/2004 13:52:52 |
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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 13:24:26
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Jim, do you think I live in a mansion on a hill or something? I live in one of the poorest states in the US. I see what you are talking about all the time.
The Rockefeller institute of Government, in 2000 estimated that the US government spent $13, 476 per person to fight poverty. The Urban institute estimates that we spent that year $10,000 per child. If you go by the Rockefeller's numbers that amounts to $53,904 for a family of 4 that the government wasted on programs to help the poor. We'd be better off just giving them the money instead of trying to "help" them.
The only people our so called "war on poverty" is helping are the bureaucrats whose jobs depend on the fact that there are poor people to "help". If those people ever became self sufficient the bureaucrats would be out of a job. We have created an entire industry based on poverty and it is essential for the people who make a living off of that industry to keep their customers poor so that they can continue working. |
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Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 14:57:00
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Jim, I wouldn't say our Kile is blind to the realities of Life in the U.S. of A. I do view it has conceptually disturbing, his addiction to the propaganda of Clear Channel Communication's resident radio proagandist, the slime of audio modulation, Rush Limbaugh. I fear for his being brainwashed like some poor GI's were by the commies in North Korea some 50+ years ago. I am convinced the 9-11 terrorists were trying to crash into the EIB network and hit the wrong buildings. Had they done so and also kamakized into the studios of Hollywood with empty planes, I'd have a lot more sympathy for their cause.
But, it is relative how poverty is defined and a large measure has to do with global comparasions. Coincidentally, the lead article in the editorial section of todays Express-News deals with the CBS story in 1968 on poverty in America and how it was manufactured and facts manipulated to create an illusion to justify the premise. I won't go into details, but suffice it to say, propaganda is used by all sides of the political, media, business and government to advance their particular viewpoint. Rather than bickering about what poverty is, I maintain the real crime against America comes from the intentional devaluing of our money by the Yankee government so they can repay budget deficeits with increasingly worthless paper dollars. This has been going on since before Vietnam in my memory, (some would say it goes back another 50 years). For corporate America to then abandon us to ship factories and jobs overseas adds insult to injury. (Guess what? Another newspaper article deals with that, too, in todays paper. Ha! Does not your favorite Minster of Propaganda always bring good news to you naked savages?) |
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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 15:41:19
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Ghost, why is it if someone holds conservative views and believes that our government should function the way the constitution says it should, that person is automatically accused of being brainwashed by Rush Limbaugh? Who brainwashed you? Al Gore? Michael Moore? Al Franken?
No, I am not brainwashed. I have come to the conclusions that I have come to by simple common sense and the possesion of a strong work ethic and a sense of personal responsibility. Things that those who's income falls below the poverty level are often lacking.
I am currently reading a book called "The Poverty of Welfare; Helping Others in Civil Society" by Michael D. Tanner. It is a great book, I recommend it to anyone who is concerned with the condition of America's welfare system.
Traditionally the major support system for all people has been the family unit, the church and the community. In that order. The welfare system in this country has destroyed that by making the government the sole provider for many families. Since welfare has been in place, the number of single parent households and out of wed-lock births has skyrocketed. The family is no longer important for the survival of children and the lower income, nuclear family has almost ceased to exist in most cities in this country because mom and the kids get a bigger check from the government if daddy's not around. This must change if we ever hope to truly win the war on poverty. |
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Ghostbuster
476 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 17:22:45
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BRAINWASHED??? BRAINWASHED??? I'll tell you who brainwashed me!
I was brainwashed by the likes of Roy, and Gene, and Hop-a-long. And, Bugs and Daffy, the Three Stooges, W.C. Fields, Red Skelton, Jack Benny, Gary Cooper and Randolph Scott. Let us not forget the one true patron saint of American imagery...our John Wayne. Did I mention also the Public Education System including Grades One & Two there in Pineville, La?
Stand tall, look sharp, and shoot straight!
But...when it comes to political idealogies...left or right...it will always be a case of Dweedle-dee and Dweedle-dum. Regardless of whom we vote for, in the end, it is all us Joe Lunchboxes that wind up paying to get the shaft. When I was 20, I was a Democrat. When I was 30, I was a Republican. When I was 40, I was a Libertarian. Now, I just want them to leave me alone.
Is there Poverty in America? Both sides of this discussion are right. It's all a matter of perspective. |
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KileAnderson
USA
875 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 17:32:46
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| I must have had 1 too many pregame brewskis. I think we are in agreement. |
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sbeau4014
USA
53 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 21:10:39
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Ghost,
I think you left off one my my personal favorite mentors from the list. Alfred E Newman, who's philosopy in life, "What Me Worry" has gotten me thru so much, including some of the rantings on this site at times.....[:D] |
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ChuckDeaton
USA
373 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2004 : 23:49:34
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| There is no reality, it's all a matter of perspective. |
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Steve H
Switzerland
30 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2004 : 23:36:27
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There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There is another theory which states that this has already happened.
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Poverty, American Style
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