|Posted on Thursday, September 14, 2000 - 7:02 pm: |
It seems that if you can't offer a superior product or price point...muddy the waters with lawyers and rhetoric.
I have recently begun testing PowerClaim and find it initially to be very useful and intuitive. I'll look forward to testing further.
It would be great to see something besides Xactimate being used. Xactimate wants to be the big dog on your computer, and heaven forbid you repartition or do other power user things.
I have also "test-driven" DDS and thought it was OK, but felt the cutesy graphic nature of the product would eventually wear on a person using it everyday into the wee hours.
Time will tell....
|Posted on Thursday, September 14, 2000 - 6:03 pm: |
I was never confused. Power Claim is Power Claim. Go get them, Gale.
|Posted on Thursday, September 14, 2000 - 1:22 am: |
DDS demands a retraction!
Word has been received that DDS does not deem it in their best financial interest to be openly compared to PowerClaim and will not be happy as long as it continues to be compared to PowerClaim.
The demand that a retraction/clarification be prepared for posting on the Catadjuster web site is in black and white. The failure to so do may permit one to visit Texas for the first time since graduating from Hardin-Simmons University over two decades ago.
One cringes at the thought of adjusters buying PowerClaim when they think they are buying DDS or the other way around because of confusing or deceiving statements made by any party. To prevent this we offer the adjusting community (which is apparently easily confused in the mind of DDS’s legal counsel) 200% more time to try PowerClaim free with the full rights provided our paying customers than apparently DDS feels is in their best financial interest to so do.
As to where DDS is 200% or 500% more expensive than PowerClaim does not really mean much to many adjusters unless they view PowerClaim as being an equal or superior way of writing an estimate when compared to DDS. Over five former DDS users have voted in favor of PowerClaim with their pocketbooks.
As initially posted in this conversation, a reference was made that DDS was around 300% more expensive than PowerClaim, which was based on a price of $119 per month ($119 x 12 = $1428 then when divided by $479 (1 yr of PowerClaim without any discounts) = 298%). This figure is the price for some DDS users if they will pay in four $357 quarterly installments according to one DDS sales person.
As the adjuster who is good with math can figure, for only $122 more up front he or she can also get the second, third and fourth quarters of PowerClaim whereas for DDS it will cost an additional $1071 of your cold, hard-earned cash.
Just in case a potential customer became confused by the initial offer to get 10 years of PowerClaim for what one would pay for only 2 years of DDS, the following Special offer is being made to DDS customers and potential DDS customers:
Take the best regular rate for DDS, $99 per month, requiring a lump sum payment of $1188 ($99 x 12 months), double that for a one time total of $2376 and get PowerClaim 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010.
Simply pay what DDS charges for 2 years of their software and get 10 years of PowerClaim, complete with toll free support and all updates released in that 10-year period free to you. If the math is correct that would make DDS about 500% more expensive than PowerClaim, which some former DDS users deem superior for their adjusting needs.
DDS has insinuated that the pricing of PowerClaim is cut throat in nature. This is false. PowerClaim pricing is not based upon what the others are demanding for their products. PowerClaim’s annual price of $279 - $479 per year is based upon market research that indicated that this is the price the consumer felt is both a fair and honest price for estimating software. It has been predicted that all property estimating software remaining on the market over the next several years will drop into this price range.
PowerClaim does request that DDS encourage its sales staff to refrain from making the statement, “Well, you get what you pay for!” when questioned about Power Claim’s superior value. As anyone who has used Netscape or Internet Explorer can tell you, “free” or inexpensive software is often the best software on the market.
For those who are still with me, let me explain what this is all about. DDS is not happy with Gale Hawkins as an individual or as a business competitor. My frank, open, and down-to-earth nature does not seem to appeal to their corporate way of doing business. Because of some statements I have made in the past on this forum and in other marketing materials, they have demanded that I retract and clarify my statements.
So to avoid any and all confusion in the future let me lay out my entire business and marketing plan for you. I intend for PowerClaim to become the most used estimating software in the adjusting industry by the fourth quarter of 2003. PowerClaim will be the easiest-to-use and will be the best value for your money while providing all the features you need. And I will tout this to high heaven every opportunity I get, as any good red-blooded American country boy would do.
I invited any consumer of estimating software to contact me at 1-800-736-1246 or email me at firstname.lastname@example.org concerning anything that you would consider confusing or misleading that has been stated in regard to PowerClaim or DDS.
|Posted on Monday, September 04, 2000 - 1:56 pm: |
Approved contractor programs are not new. All of the things mentioned except for the computer generated estimates are also old issues which rise and wane in cycles.
Contractors position in claims is an important one as are all the parties involved. But, their position is not to adjust claims. When they are put in that position, a lot of money is lost since they are in a position to make money and can't unless they cover themselves and make the insured happy at the same time. If no one inspects that claim, no one knows if the damage paid for is to repair new, old, related to the covered loss and so on. It's not the contractor's fault, it's just not their job to look at all the factors and to "ADJUST" the claim accordingly.
When following up on contractors most notable was the tendency to over scope, overprice and then not follow up on all the promises. Usually the roofer will have too many squares estimated and the price is $5 or $ more than the going amount. His estimate will also include undamaged items which he recommends be replaced. Sometimes these items need replacement but confuses the issue with the insured until adequately explained. I could go on and on, but also want to add that many contractors are excellent and straight as arrows. But still they are not there to adjust, they are there to repair and make a profit. Insurance Co's who use contractors this way are really being lazy and are gambling loss expense, paid claim amounts and future premium hikes.
As to adjuster quality, this is also an old item. If adjusters are never checked on and "training" issues addressed this occurs with those who do not have pride in what they do. No one's perfect, but when extremely large catastrophes occur this always comes up.
We must police the bad ones or like others have said, it gives us all a black eye. It's the balance of too many or not enough. Too much work or not enough. Many good adjusters are half starving and can't get work while at the same time many incompetent, whether new or old doesn't matter, are working. There are no easy answers except that wise use of IA's by Co's will enhance their image and bottom line and good competent adjusting by IA's will also help.
The fact that the issues are being discussed is a big plus.
|Posted on Sunday, September 03, 2000 - 11:55 pm: |
I'm a former contractor, I never worked for a insurance company program and considered it a welfare program for weak contractors. I have been involved in over 1000 roof claims and told every homeowner to never allow a insurance company contractor to inspect their loss. Any insured who lets a contractor scope their loss is being short changed for the premium they paid. ONLY licensed adjusters should be allowed to inspect losses. I believe that ia's will be writing estimates for contractors in the not too distant future. You are qualified and have the equipment to write an estimate and post digital photos to a web file page. Ia's are 10 years ahead of contractors when it comes to writing estimates. Insurance restoration is only a minute percentage of the estimating that needs to be done, just because a few insurance contractors are computer literate does not mean they all are nor that they are even interested in turning on a pc. I'm currently exploring ways to harness the ia skills and market them to contractors. In the future professional home improvement estimates will cost money and the ia is uniquely qualified to produce them. Ninety eight percent of contractors do not have the people with the skills necessary to produce an estimate worth paying for and they are also too cheap to provide their people with the equipment and training necessary. Hope you won't mind making money off the contractors in the future because I can see it coming.
|Posted on Friday, August 25, 2000 - 12:59 am: |
RJ, you are so right that estimating software is only a tool. And in untrained hands, it can become a quite dangerous tool.
You can hand a Stradivarius to Bozo the Clown and it will still sound like Bozo the Clown playing a pawn shop fiddle on a broken down scratchy Two Dollar radio.
On the other hand, you can hand a pawn shop fiddle to Itshak Perelman and it will sound like a Stradivarius in the hands of the Maestro at Carnegie Hall.
In the hands of a trained professional adjuster, estimating software can enable a qualified professional to become a "Maestro" in cat adjusting while providing more harmonious service to clients and customers.
In the hands of the incompetent adjuster, it only allows them to do a lot more damage faster.
|Posted on Friday, August 25, 2000 - 12:23 am: |
Software is only a tool. As a tool just about anyone can generate repair estimates all day long. However, everyone is missing the real problem in using contractors to adjust claims. The majority of contractors don't have a clue how to read, understand, comprehend and apply policy provisions to a loss nor do they care to. A contractor's primary interest is contracting work, not adjusting claims. They write an estimate for free just to get the work. If an adjuster was going to profit from writing an estimate like a contractor does we would probably end up in jail for insurance fraud. The very concept of using a contractor to settle a loss sets up an automatic conflict of interest. Sure a contractor can produce an estimate just like an adjuster, however, without the proper training & experience it is scary to think that if I were a carrier paying claims on the basis of a contractor's estimate and that contractor & his estimators do not have the proper training, licences, E & O insurance coverage and professional experience, I would be placing the carriers liability exposure open without being in any position to defend myself in case of a law suit. A plaintiff's attorney would have a field day in court with an almost open & shut case against the carrier.
Expanding on coverages for just a moment I would like to point out that just because damage occurred to the insured structure and/or contents does not automatically mean there is coverage for insured's loss under his policy provisions. This determination is very involved & can change from insured location to location & from policy to policy. I personally have inspected losses that exceeded several hundred thousand dollars and have determined that the policy purchased by the insured will not provide coverage for their loss. After several days investigating the cause & origin of one large loss, that comes to mind, I was able to document that the insured's loss was not due to a covered cause of loss, therefore, I recommended denial of the claim to the carrier. If a contractor was sent out to write the damage estimate the carrier in all probability would have paid this claim. This shows why every claim, large or small, should be investigated by a qualified adjuster to determine if the loss was due to a covered cause of loss or not before a tape measure or any scoping of the loss begins. When a carrier decides to use a contractor they should realize that the contractor is only going to write the repair estimate and that is why it is crazy for any carrier to engage in this practice. As a general rule contractors make repairs to buildings and they do not get involved in the claims process other than provide repair estimates. Personally we do not get involved with any contractor unless the insured has hired him & designates the contractor as him personal representative or at the request of the carrier. Even when a contractor is involved in a loss we conduct our own investigation & prepare our own scope of damages & final report.
Claims managers & carriers that make decisions to use unqualified individuals & contractors to adjust claims do so at great risk. Sure they will save a few dollars in adjuster service fees, but all it would take is one lawsuit and the amount they saved in adjuster service bills will only amount to pocket change in comparison to the cost of defending just one law suit win or not. Can you imagine how much a class action suit would cost them if the court ruled that this practice was determined to be an unfair claims practice? Suddenly that dime they saved on adjuster service fees is costing many dollars.
Fortunately, most carriers have qualified claims managers & corporate officers that understand the problem in using the contractor program to adjust claims and don't even go there. Those that use contractors to evaluate & settle losses should consult their legal department.
As for the software being used by the contractors I believe this is a good tool for them. At least when we do have to deal with contractors that use the software it is easier to settle a loss with them. However, this is only valid for estimating the damages not for determining coverages.
There is a big difference in the contractor qualifications & that of a qualified adjuster. To even think there is competition between the Two professions is not logical. Ask yourself would I have a nurse perform heart surgery. Of course not, just because a nurse works in the medical field does not mean she or he could perform heart surgery. The same holds true for contractors vs adjusters, while the nurse has a certain level of medical knowledge and provides assistance to the heart surgeon, the contractors can provide assistance to the adjuster. Just as the surgeon has to conduct the operation personally so does the adjuster. That means that the adjuster that makes the judgement call as to cause & origin to determine coverage of the insured's loss will have to at the very least inspect the loss on sight personally. Anything short of that the carrier may leave their liability exposure wide open and may not have any defense in any possible litigation.
In closing software programs are only a tool of the trade. To believe it should be restricted to adjusters only is not good for the industry as a whole. Like it or not adjuster's have to deal with contractors, public adjusters and attorneys in the course of claims handling. If everyone was well versed in the use of the software adjusting programs the claims process would flow easier.
|Posted on Thursday, August 24, 2000 - 10:15 pm: |
Brittanyh you are very correct about the fact software makes it easier for contractors to turn in estimates that the carriers will pay off of and by-pass the traditional adjusters because the reports give the carriers what they want to see.
What the adjuster sees as a source of income and wants to charge to do the contractor may see it as a give away to get more construction work for his crews or himself depending on the size of his business.
The fact is when one needs an item and one place is selling that item and another is offering it free guess which one has the most volume of business? There are nationwide contractors that do nothing but insurance jobs as well as many smaller firms.
Your service master type businesses are doing more and more adjusting. Since they are usually the first to the loss they can create an estimate and fax or email it to the carrier quickly and get the check on the way. They even act as the general contractor and sub out the heavy damage to contracting friends or business associates.
The small plus in this for you is more software is purchased which drives down you cost. In 3-5 years I expect the average adjuster or contractor will not be paying more than $300 a year and perhaps less but a vendor will need to be selling about 10,000 copies annually to stay around so expect the number of software vendors to be cut in half in the years ahead through mergers and other means.
Some like you that have a contracting background are going back into that business and all they do is the estimating of insured losses and subbing it out. You know there is going to be a payday because the money is coming from the carrier.
Yes a few contractors will commit insurance fraud and do some serious jail time but most will do the estimating free and make a living. The contractor is motivated to do a good job so the homeowner does not complain and some carriers see it is a win-win for business.
A happy customer and no adjusting cost are good for the bottom line. Heck, contractors have been giving away free estimations for a long time as you know.
|Posted on Friday, August 18, 2000 - 2:30 pm: |
Brittany has some good points.
As Jim Flynt said (and I have experienced the same problem with file quality while working re-opens from Minnesota 98 claims even as recently as July) the quality of the work of some CAT adjusters is very, very bad. I was embarrassed to see the file quality of some adjusters that were working for my vendor at that time.
If we do not upgrade file quality and pay more attention to details we WILL be getting a smaller and smaller piece of the pie. We are paid what is perceived to be a large amount of money per file. The carriers expect the work to be done properly. Sure, everyone makes mistakes and may miss something every now and then. No one is perfect. But when a particular adjuster makes the same "mistake" over and over during the same storm, that adjuster needs to be made aware of the problem. The problem should be corrected or the adjuster should find another way to make a living. The vendor should NOT continue to send that adjuster to storms knowing the adjuster doesn't do quality work. As hard as times are right now for CAT adjusters it would be fairly easy for the vendors to weed out those adjusters who are not performing well. In July I sent 6 files back to the field for reinspection. The situation was one in which one insured owned 7 properties. The same adjuster scoped all the properties. One house had one layer of roofing material. The rest had 2 or 3 and the bottom layers were wood and decking was an issue (how much money did that adjuster lose?). It was apparent that this adjuster never, ever checked the number of layers. And since the adjuster had left the area the reinspection had to be performed by another adjuster. This adjuster was paid to do the reinspect. The carrier sees this as paying twice for something which should only have been paid once.
So if a carrier can send out a contractor to scope a loss and write the estimate, the carrier saves the fee that the carrier would normally pay to the IA. In this, Brittany is correct. The carriers may turn more and more to contractors. I think they would prefer to use an IA. If they don't get the quality of the work, they'll take their chances on paying a few dollars more for a roof than paying an IA twice. This may or may not blow up and cost them more in the long run, but the cost is for the actual loss and not an expense. We IA's are an expense item. Some years they watch claim costs and some years expense costs.
I think, before worrying about who is using what software, we need to clean up our own backyards and produce a consistent and quality work product. After we "fix" ourselves and our own work products we can then worry about what others are doing.
|Posted on Friday, August 18, 2000 - 10:35 am: |
I agree with John Postava. Because there is contractor software doesnt mean Carriers are going to use Contractors! It is a guarded secret that Carriers are out for PROFIT!!! Adjusters not concerned with "CUSTOMER SERVICE" should sell roofs for a living! Im not just talking about the Insureds. Carriers,adjusting firms,Agents are our Customers also. All the Software in the world won't keep us working! Knowing how to make the Insured whole after a loss will keep everyone happy!! Look for damage,if it can be repaired and make the customer whole,repair it.If its Questionable replace it.TAKE CARE OF YOUR CUSTOMERS AND YOU WILL PROSPER!!Sorry about the yelling! Have a great day and please BE SAFE.
|Posted on Friday, August 18, 2000 - 12:54 am: |
All of you have some great points, however, as I said before, I feel that there are many who have their head in the sand. I know the other programers also have a contractor program to, but you seem to be missing the point. If you think that by being this close to the contractors and teaching them how to to "handle" claims is not in direct competition with us, you are sadly mistaken. I don't fault the companies like Simsol for making money, thats why I said "Friend, Foe, or Just Money." The point that I was trying to make is that the easier that they make it for contractors to do our job the less we will get of the pie.
Jim Flynt probably hit the nail on the head though. It is really the quality of the job that is being done by some of us and the vendors that we work for, that is turning the carriers away from using independent adjusters along with the expense factor that I stated in the opening remarks.
As recently as this year I know of one vendor that had adjusters give as many as 20 files to roofing contractors and had them scope, photo, and diagram the losses for them. And we wonder why the carriers are wanting to use contractors to do our job. BEAM ME UP!!!!!!
I am not just some "new kid on the block." I was a general contractor for 15 years and have been adjusting for over 20 years.
All I am saying is we better wake up and start doing what we are paid to do and try to weed out the people who are destroying our profession. Those of use that can and do provide a quality product will prevail in the end. I HOPE!
|Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2000 - 6:44 pm: |
Hey, folks. We have been selling a contractor version of SIMSOL since 1990 (yes, way back in the DOS days). We sell to contractors because they write estimates and need to "eat" too. As a side benefit, when a contractor writes an estimate with SIMSOL FOR CONTRACTORS, he or she is writing an estimate with the same estimating database used by the adjuster version of the system. This makes it very easy to handle the loss (so long as both the adjuster and contractor can agree on scope).
To answer Brittany's question, there is NO difference between the ADJUSTER and CONTRACTOR versions of our software when it comes to the estimating sections. The adjuster version has insurance forms and other items that only adjusters use (such as a "Depreciation" column in the estimate)and the contractor version has a Job Cost module that is not needed by adjusters.
SIMSOL also sells to Public Adjusters. We acutally have a large following of these folks. They also estimate losses. At first we were wary of selling to "the other side" but now think it is a good idea because if a P.A. uses SIMSOL and is handling a loss with one of our carriers or adjusters, we can archive his/her scope and load it into our computer to verify that the costs of both databases are the same (and the P.A. can do the same with one of the adjuster's estimates).
In the end, SIMSOL sells estimating and adjusting software. The politics of adjusting and handling claims is changing but we have no control over that aspect of the industry. We just try to write the tools used by all the players. Our intention is not to take away work from anyone - just make the work they do easier...
As always, any questions about software are welcome and will be answered, my me, as candidly as possible (remember, I am an adjuster you know!!!)
|Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2000 - 9:56 am: |
brittanyh- not only am i glad to see dds coming up with a contractor's version, i even suggested that to them some time back. reason being that i like dds and would like to see it even more widely accepted and it's use by contractors will help it get along in that direction. do we need to point out that exactamate & simsol already have contractor's versions? and that, imho, one of the stronger arguements for using exactamate is the fact that so many contractors also use that program? also, it's a lot easier to settle a claim when you and the repairman are both on the same pricelist and program. as far as the carriers settling some claims via use of estimates from contractors and body shops- that's been commonplace to some extent for at least the 30 years that i've been in this busiess. actually, i'm more concerned about the quality of work being done by independants that about whatever a contracter might be taking from us. read jim flynt's post and take it serious. this year i've seen more than enough stuff like he's talking about. there appears to be a good many "adjustors" out there, and some roofing salesmen, who not only don't know how to measure a roof, but who don't really care enough to even get on the roof in the first place. there are also some adjusters who seem unable to distinguish between hail/wind damage and age/deteriation/manufacturing problems. also some "adjusters" who take shortcuts such as conveniently overlooking damages (sometimes even entire bldgs)and of failing to explain to an insured in order to get a closing quicker. and i know of at least two carrier supervisors and one independant supervisor who accept this as commonplace behavior with independants. that says a whole lot about how the industry regards us and is truly scarey. rather than complain about the software vendors and the contractors, i think all of us would be better served if we first cleaned up our own house.
|Gale Hawkins (Gale)|
|Posted on Thursday, August 17, 2000 - 2:16 am: |
Brittanyh I think many will relate to your concerns that the average adjuster will continue to see their income erode over the next 5 – 10 years. There is also without doubt that most readers as Lee as already clearly stated will see your blame as misplaced.
Although PowerClaim is focused on property adjusting software until we own that market we still have a few contractors buying PowerClaim. The main reason is that these contractors are learning they are giving the insured bids that are often thousands of dollars less than the insured collected from the carrier.
You are correct that with property adjusting software and a little computer savvy just about any contractor can replace you if you are talking about simple losses that are commonplace. In fact most anyone can learn to do this type of scoping fairly quickly and is something any good contractor already knows.
For about five years now I have been working with property insurance adjusters on a daily bases and the one thing I have learned is that scoping in no more than 10% of what is required for an true adjuster to be successful. Not to take away from the importance of scoping at all but there is so much more that is required to successfully close a file in a manner that it stays closed.
You are correct in that more and more carriers do not plan for an adjuster to see claims that are under $10K and it is going to really hurt your income because they are your bread and butter. Inside adjusters (telephone adjusters) and contractors will handle the bulk of these most likely for some time to come but in Cat situations it is not reasonable to expect that will be the case.
Perhaps your income will never be what it was even 10 years ago but do not feel like the Lone Ranger. This is happening in many other industries.
DDS may have make a lot of money off of the backs of the adjusters but I bet you could find at least one of their investors that may take you to task on that issue Put yourself in the shoes of DDS. They have spent millions to get to where they are today and probably will spent another 5+ million to develop the services they have announced just this year that will be coming on line in the years ahead.
When you stop and realize after spending millions and millions of dollars over the past 5 to 10 years they now find themselves charging 300% or more for their software than software that has since come on to the market that is superior in function, easy-of-use and with much less of a learning curve than DDS according to former DDS users.
Brittanyh there is no question you are suffering in part due to the technology advances that have brought about the “New Economy” but as you can see some older technology companies that stay in business are going to have to figure out how to offer better service and better quality products for 33% of what they are currently charging.
There is going to be less and less cash flashed in many industries in the years ahead I expect. Ours will be not different. If Allstate finds success in by passing the agent and since Allstate insures me I do not see why they won’t be successful with the fifty and under crowd, why would they not by pass the adjuster if it does not hurt the earnings and especially if it helps the earnings.
“New Economy” is new as the term states so none of us really knows what changes it may bring but if history is of any value we know the flexible ones will gain and the inflexible ones will be broken. One’s cost structure in business may be the factor that makes or breaks one in this “New Economy” if the past can serve as a light for the future.
|Lee Mushaney (Red)|
|Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2000 - 10:38 pm: |
I don't know if your a new adjuster
but apparently you haven't used any major programs that is standard in the industry.
Xactimate, simsol, and DDS--ALL-- have programs that also have a contractor version. I personally don't see a problem. Infact, it can help us deal with contractors that we might otherwise have a problem dealing with. They have the same information we have and they also know what is included with the operations and how the figures are arrived. I find it is helpful to have them on the same page especially when we need an "Agreed price" to settle the problem claims. It is a version of the program, and from my understanding it isn't the SAME version we use but the basics are the same. Perhaps someone DDS or J. Postava of Simsol could give us a complete defination of the difference between our version and the contractors version.
|Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2000 - 9:48 pm: |
It has come to our attention that DDS has recently completed an estimating program for "contractors" to use. I have not seen it or know what it consists of, but it disturbs me very much that this company that has made its "nitch" off the backs of the adjuster is producing a program for contractors.
WHY? Because the independent adjuster is in direct competition with contractors. If you have to ask how, then you must have your head in the sand and not paying attention.
More and more carriers are using the DRP or Perferred Contractor program to "adjust" their claims for them. They say not, however, this is in fact just what they are doing. The contractor is writing the damages for them and the carrier is determining coverage and paying the claim, based on the contractors estimate. Years ago this was considered to be like "turning the fox loose in the hen house." Now more of them are raising the limit that contractors can write. I know of one carrier that lets the contractor write up to $10,000.00. What does this do for your pay check, if you were not given any claims below $10,000.00? Need I ask.
There a two reasons for this. Both have to do with money. One, the carrier does not have to pay for handling the claim by a staff person or independent. In most states the carrier cannot pass on the "claims expense" to the consumer by a rate increase. No expense, no loss. It takes a long time for underwriting to find out that their severity goes out of sight, but who cares, they get a rate increase based on severity, not expenses.
So, is DDS, who has and is making a fortune off independent adjusters, where they got their start, doing us favors? Hell, with their program and a little computer savoy, just about any contractor could replace us. I know, you say they don't know coverage, do you really think the carriers care? Or does DDS care that they are helping contractors take food out of our mouths?
Give me your thoughts and if you feel like me let DDS know what you think. If we don't, WHO WILL?