| Author |
Message |
Tom Anderson
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 29, 1999 - 9:02 pm: | |
When I joined NACA in 1978, the idea according to
Bill Holland, was medical insurance, e and o coverage, meetings to standardize billing schedules, news letters and info to help us as
independents. The directory is helpful but most are calls from companies wanting to on stand by and you never hear from them again. The cost
was 15.00 when I joined. Now it takes 60-70000
dollars to run. To be listed, just send them $100 and a reference. Qualifications do not matter. |
Tom Weems
| | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 1999 - 8:35 pm: | |
One of the joys of NACA is that you can get your E&O thru them at reasonable rates. |
Tom Joyce
| | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 1999 - 1:20 pm: | |
Care to share with us where those coverages are available for that price?????????
The umbrella liability and business PC available by end. to HO in many cases, but the E&O and workers comp. |
Dave Dehlinger
| | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 1999 - 12:47 pm: | |
Any Cat adjuster that doesn't have his own W/C, E&O, business package for P/C and a personal umbrella, is just asking for it. However, the costs of all of these coverages shouldn't be more than $1250 per year. Unless, of course, you live in CA, and your E&O may be that high alone. When you add all of these costs with computer upgrades, software upgrades, car payments and insurance,camera's, etc. You're talking about alot of money. I figure that most of the first storm each year goes just to take care of this overhead.
The insurance industry in general would love it if they never had to hire an independent or CAT adjuster again. The thought of us boycotting certain companies will not phase them. They will hire ill trained scabs and keep on truckin. We are just going to have to learn to work within their guidelines or not work for them again. I worked for State Farm towards the end of my "Andrew" hitch and would neve want to go thru that again. Fortunately, I've never had to turn down work from them. I think I'd probably want to "flip" burgers. |
Ghostbuster
| | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 1999 - 10:48 am: | |
Ditto!
Now, if I can just persuade my evil sister-in-laws to conjure up a Santa Ana wind storm in warm California after Xmas, wouldn't that be loverly? |
stormcrow
| | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 1999 - 10:21 am: | |
Well said and I wouldn't have it any other way...
I can make a $$$ travel see new places
and enjoy adjusting again.... |
Tom Wems
| | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 1999 - 9:32 am: | |
I have been reading with great interest the posts of the last few weeks. There have been a number of very valid points raised that need to be discussed. With this in mind, I went back into some of my old “storm books” to look at the schedules we have worked for in the past. It ended up being a sobering exercise. How soon we forget how good the “good ole days” actually were.
Most people remember with fondness the great schedules that we had in Hurricane Andrew. Well, an accurate look backwards is called for. Sports fans, the 0-$500 scale was $80 to $90! We worked these schedules until early 1994! T&E was $40, photos were $1.25 to $1.50! Mileage, get real. This is looking at 12 different schedules in 1993 to 1994. Five years ago. When was the last time anyone worked a file (non-SF) for less than $125? Most T&E is $70 or so now, and some companies actually pay us mileage. Most of the vendors pass the $2 photo fee through to us as a file expense. Not 5 years ago! The schedules were awful at the mid ranges too and T&E after $10k to $25k.
The reason we made such good money during Andrew was the damage! Opal excepted, there has not been too many good hurricanes, but is that anyone’s fault? Several of the companies are offering benefits that were unheard of 5 years ago. That doesn’t mean that we should meekly lower our heads and take what is dished out. But I was shocked when I took a good realistic look backwards. I think the problem lies in a completely different area.
We have all seen companies throw money at insureds that become a pest just to make them go away. They are unwilling to do that for us for one good reason. There is no reinsurance for adjustment expenses.
These file expenses are also not included in the rate base that the underwriters are allowed by the insurance department to use to set the rates the policyholders pay. This is a POLITICAL problem, exacerbated by the politicians that run for and are elected to, the insurance departments in the various states. If the companies cannot recapture the adjustment costs from the insured through his rates, they will try and minimize them however they can. These are bean counters folks. Anybody out there really think insurance companies care about independent adjusters?
This is an ever-changing environment we work in. Lawyers and bean counters make the rules. IMHO the day of the “National Cat Agreement” is long gone. Five years ago, all the carriers wanted was photos, diagram of the roof, an estimate of the damages and a short form report. Now thanks to the litigatious society we live in, there is no difference between a cat file and a regular business file. Why then should cat files pay less than regular business files? What ever happened to “no frills”? Are they worth less just because there are a lot of them?
Many of us have worked for companies that we assume carry our E&O coverage. Have you ever wondered what happens if there is a claim? Two of the biggest and best out there have a $100,000 deductible! Now just whom do you think would have to pay the deductible? Remember if it isn’t in writing it isn’t so. You are doing a disservice to yourself and those who depend on you by not carrying your own coverage. At least enough to pay the deductible is something goes wrong.
Also have you ever asked anyone the details of the workman’s comp coverage? Well guess what. Some of you guys don’t have any, even if you think you do. Have you seen agreement or coverage details? No you haven’t. There is an adjuster that I know that has had nothing but trouble out of a well-respected vender because they are “self insured”. Translation, they have no insurance! How about the branch manager of an upper Midwest vendor that fights your unemployment claims when he runs out of files and releases you? Have you asked what all that is they take out of your check? Or have you asked why we are sometimes required to buy T-shirts or caps so we can wear someone’s logo on our bodies while we work, or pay $100 for a database or rent software to work for a particular vendor? We are all independent businessmen (or women) so all this must be considered before taking an assignment. Do I have to fly to get there? Who pays for the ticket if I do? What is the fee schedule? How many files can I expect to get? Important questions if you aspire to be a professional in this business.
Don’t forget education. Are you continually improving your skills and knowledge? Or are you a glorified house inspector? In a catastrophe situation, you should be able to handle any files that they can throw at you. Commercial, Business Interruption and flood are files just like any other. If you can’t handle them, why not? The education you need is all around you. There are a lot of staff adjusters out there that look down on cat adjusters because there is a general impression that we are less educated and capable than they, yet we make more money than they do. To those of you that think that, let me remind you that we do not have the luxury of sleeping in our own beds every night, surrounded by those who love us. We live in a pressure cooker, many miles from home. We work long hours, have no large corporate structure surrounding us and are required to work long hour’s 7 days a week, sometimes for months on end. Ours is no job for the weak or the sane. If we were comfortable in a cubicle, we would have one. You have to be a little nuts to do this, but ain’t it fun……. |
Tom toll
| | Posted on Monday, December 06, 1999 - 1:04 pm: | |
REALITY/DREAMS
Dreaming is the thinking process in reverse. Dreaming is the minds garbage disposal process. Dreams help purge the mind of unintegrated clutter, mysticism, and meaningless non sequiturs absorbed while awake. Dreams have no meanings or connections to reality. Dream analysis is nothing more than feeding regurgitated clutter back into the mind. Plus, the more mysticism and non sequiturs that crowd the mind, the more frequent and nightmarish dreams become. Then subsequent dreams increasingly lose their therapeutic, garbage disposing effect. If the mind becomes increasingly loaded with mystical notions, one's dreams grow less effective in purging and protecting the mind from clutter. The mind then becomes unable to store, integrate, or function efficiently enough to let that person live as a happy, intelligent, productive, conscious being. We therefore must quit dreaming and regurgitating and develop a sense of reality of what and who we are and where we want to go.
A union of catastrophe adjusters is a mystical/non sense notion that all should group together for the benefit of all. It will not and cannot happen in today's society, as we have too many who are illiterate in thought and certainly in education and knowledge in the adjusting methodology. This is a difficult endeavor, to say the least, requiring many years of education and practical application. Please do not try to convince those with reasonable intelligence that the vendors/companies should pay an equal amount to those who have not taken the opportunity to educate themselves. Whether we wish to believe it or not, there are those in this occupation for money only, not the satisfaction of knowing they have helped someone in distress. Greed is the ruination of societal purposes, which needs to be purged from our occupation.
There are those who stand around arbitrarily moaning that they are not making enough income for their effort, yet I see little effort on their part. A person should deliver competitive value to be a value to others. Such a growth process is the essence of human living. Compassion in our field should be a common denominator and goal. We then, will be compensated for this rationale.
An organization for the purposes of education and common thought is a concept that has existed since man realized he has a larger brain capacity than his non thinking ancestors. Now is the time to purge the ineffective quibbles and proceed with our passion to persevere. CADO is the place to initiate this process, no doubt. Remember the three P's always. Perception, perseverance, and perspicacity.
I turned sixty years of age this past November 22, and as of November 29th, have been a licensed adjuster for 38 years. Does this mean that I know all. Absolutely not. I have heard and seen the writing of those who apparently seem to know all there is to know about this occupation. To them I salute and in my subconscious feel sorry for, as there is no one on earth who can possibly know all that is to be known about our field of endeavor. But the resources could be had through the CADO system to better understand that which we do not know. The quibbling seen on this page is disheartening. Some are eloquent in their posting, some are obviously illiterate and don't subscribe to the common sense given to each one of us. Rational, cognitive posting is a plus for all of us. Why must we disguise ourselves behind names that have no meaning. Our names represent who and what we are, either by fact or reputation. Let us all become what we can become. |
Mike Hunt
| | Posted on Sunday, December 05, 1999 - 7:49 am: | |
Hey Joe, Bye Bye. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen! |
Joe W. Rasco
| | Posted on Saturday, December 04, 1999 - 10:30 am: | |
Thank you Phantom. I wish I knew who you are. Perhaps someday I will. I realize ANONYMOUS can not tarnish a reputation that it took a lifetime to build. I am only sorry he is ill informed. Thanks again Phantom. I have read your items you have posted and though I do not agree we need a union I think you have a very good insight what is going on in this business.
As for me, I plan to delete this location from my favorites as soon as I finish this. I do wish each of you health and a happy life. That goes for whoever Anonymous is as well.
Good bye. |
THE PHANTOM
| | Posted on Saturday, December 04, 1999 - 6:23 am: | |
GUESS WHAT? THE PHANTOM IS BACK!
I just returned to ask and tell ANONYMOUS a couple of things.
If you are really a backer, why would you post something like you did about a fellow adjuster with the reputation that Mr. Rasco enjoys? As far as that goes, why post something like that about anyone else just because you may not agree with their stand?
Those of us that have been around very long in this industry either know or have heard of him. I am one of the fortunate ones that not only know him but also have worked along side of him. (Flipping his burgers of course) His reputation precedes him. If he says something is black, you can put your last dollar on black. MY MONEY IS ON RASCO! I have seen him take his time to help his fellow adjusters many times. I have never known this man to be selfish as you stated. ANONYMOUS, you would do well to pattern yourself after him. You are only spreading bad will just because someone disagrees with you about a union. Why say anything? What do you think you will gain? In my opinion, you and several others in this forum needs to tighten your cannon and gain some class if this union thing ever hopes to fly.
THE PHANTOM STRIKES AGAIN! NOW RESTING ------- |
Joe W. Rasco
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 10:17 pm: | |
To Anonumous:
I learned years ago that it is much easier to be critical than to be correct at times. True, I was tipped off by the reinsurance company that HIG was going under fast and I told everyone there I worked with that I saw and everyone on the island adjusting claims that I knew. Their response I remember was a lot of laughing. I still lost $19,000 and had the inside skinny because of the small pockets of the guy we were working for. That is the only time I ever lost a dime in this business I might add.
Let me just ask you one question. Isn't it strange to you that the newslady called ME before the 6:00 news break to let me know beforehand that the anouncement was coming? I wonder how she just happened to have my number.
Whoever you are, if you think I have ever been cut throat, it's because you don't have your facts straight. Have a good holiday season! |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 7:37 pm: | |
Realistic, it is true that just having a strong, highly functioning organization of adjusters will not mean that the organization will be able to control the carriers. From what I am hearing there is no desire to “control the carriers” but what is wanted is to be able to have some input as to how their actions impact the adjuster. Both parties can wind up with more money in their pockets if they work together in a positive way. Carriers know professional and currently trained adjusters save them money over just using warm bodies yet in a cat situation they are under great pressure to get a ‘body’ to the loss ASAP. Carriers are smart business people but sometimes they have staff that is not all they could be just as there are adjusters that are not all they could be. As was pointed out in one post the carriers are in for some big losses over the next decade by most predictions. Some of their stock prices already reflect that I understand. Their losses will be less only if they have a pool of professional adjusters to call when losses do occur. I agree with your second point about fees. Our technology firm has been learning to live with deflation for nearly 10 years now but it good for you the adjuster since your hardware and software cost is over 50% less than a few years ago. Deflation would not be so bad if it was across the board but the price of living in general is still experiencing inflation at my house. I just spoke with one adjuster that got home yesterday from FL and he earned $24K in 35 days doing nearly 200 claims but he had several thousand in expenses plus 10K miles on a new truck. He said the GPS let him get on location much faster. He has been adjusting a couple years with a contracting background. He is not planning to flip any burgers unless it is in his back yard and if the predictions of cat disasters turn out to be correct neither he nor you will have too. As far as blackballing the 2 in favor of a union are not using their names it appears so they should get called when the big one comes. |
Realistic
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 6:38 pm: | |
Ghostbuster even though you think State Farm learned their lesson in Andrew, in all reality they didn't.
When the Minnesota hail storm hit about 18 months ago, the same thing happened. They started bringing in auto adjusters and people off the street. These carriers want someone that doesn't know any better.
When will they learn, that is a good question. Personally I don't see it in my lifetime.
The same thing will happen in a major cat also. If there is a boycott of the storm, then I gaurantee you they will get through it. Everyone thinks that they are going to make a difference by starting a union or an organization, but in reality they are going to be out of work. The fees do suck for what we have to do, but as I said earlier I doubt anything will come out of these efforts.
The main reason I say this is that someone is going to have to have some damn DEEP DEEP pockets as I doubt any adjuster is willing to part with if they did have it.
Main thing is watch your back, and be careful who you work for.
HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO ALL |
Ghostbuster
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 11:24 am: | |
Having been at State Farms Dadeland office in the first wave of independents at Andrew, I believe that Lil' Eds Big ol Insurance Co learned its lesson about throwing kids at Real Man size cats and I still have their internal memo showing the savings in claim costs twixt us & their kids. Even after adding our fee bills onto the claim cost, we still beat them in overall costs. I believe that memo was a major factor in the setup of Natcat and inclusion & begrudging acceptance of we independent "hairballs". With my last storm with them, the independents continue to outpace the kids in production, insureds relations, and that old bugaboo, claim costs! And, with the downsizing in staff, they will need us even more at future cats. I do not have much to fuss about SF but other carriers such as Farmers, Allstate, Travelers and You fill in the blank ________ Ins Co, are something else. Their overall problem is being too cheap in the expenditure of funds to work each cat file properly. There in lies the fundamental problem. Like my wife says, " Being cheap is not attractive." |
S Shores
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 8:02 am: | |
Yes, State Farm can always go hire more warm bodies if the seasoned professionals were to refuse to work for them or go on strike.
That is what they did in Miami during Hurricane Andrew. They hired a lot of 21 year old girls, put a checkbook in their hand, and then turned them loose to go pay $150,000 policy limits for what were $30,000 losses.
Of course they can do that again. Multipy $120,000 overpayments by the tens of thousands of claims which they have and see what you get,,,,,,bankruptcy.
Had it not been for the State Farm Auto Company stepping in and saving their behinds (Roy doesn't allow us to use a word that rhymes with pass), the State Farm Property & Casualty Company would have been history after Andrew. |
Realistic
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 7:40 am: | |
To each and every one of you wheather it is a union or an organized effort, my hat is off to you for your efforts.
A couple of questions I would have in my mind is this.
1.What makes you think that just because you organize that each and every carrier will not bring in either auto adjusters or hire people off the streets like State Farm does to get through it. Sure they are going to have hell with complaints, but these carriers have deep pockets and can get through it believe me.
2.After 10 years are so now we have not seen the fee schedules go up. These carriers are looking at the predictions for the next 10 years which say that we will have some of the worst cats in history. Don't you think that these guys are going to just retrain and get through this. There is always someone out there willing to work for less.
I don't mean to downplay the efforts set forth by these gentlemen that are making an effort. I do believe that one again each and everyone had better watch their step and realize that you could really get blackballed and not earn an income at all. You really might be flipping burgers like the PHANTOM says. I wish you gentlemen the best of luck with your efforts, and I hope that your efforts don't hurt you in the future.
HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO EACH ONE OF YOU AND YOUR FAMILIES. |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Friday, December 03, 1999 - 6:41 am: | |
The only solution to the weakness of being unorganized, is to organize more effectively.
This will not happen without union help. I believe that a union is coming, and we will get the help to do it. Not because the successful have wished it upon themselves. Heaven forbid if they should speak out for everyone not as fortunate.
The arguments I'm hearing which reiterate "independent" are weak indeed, and I well recall how one adjuster named Joe "Rascal" failed to tell his fellow adjusters about the bankruptsies in Hawaii before he left there back in 1992, which I know he was aware of before everyone else, and which I found out about later. Thank God for the "anonymous" adjuster who alerted the news media of the bankruptsies and saved our asses, making headlines, and forcing the state to step in much earlier than it would have otherwise. Without that, we would of all been screwed far worse.
This sort of "independent", cut throat mentality is what makes the profession weak, and look so foolish in the face of the industry. It's selfish it's WRONG.
If you all can't see that the only organization, with the teeth of the law behind it, is a union, then you're fooling yourselves. I've been watching silently and reading all the arguments, as well as talking to friends in the airline industry. I don't want a union any more than anyone else, but I think it's the only organization that will work for everyone.
I also believe that it should be organized as anonymously as possible, because the vendors will have less of a target to attack in the early stages. It's a good strategy by Union Cat Adjuster.
Strong Union Supporter
P.S. Don't deny it Joe, I know you knew and you got your money and ran without a whisper to the rest of us ........ |
Russ Lott
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 01, 1999 - 3:07 am: | |
Joe, no need to apologize. This is what the community needs, the open flow of ideas and suggestions. Without your input a whole segment of the adjusting community would have been silent. Only by stirring the pot will this "thing" get hashed out. I took no offense and neither should you at the frank and open discussion going on here. |
Joe W. Rasco
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 11:31 pm: | |
Sorry------I did not mean to create such a stir. I only wanted those that did not realize NACA existed to know. Also, I was not speaking for the members, just me. |
THE PHANTOM
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 8:50 pm: | |
PLEASE SEE AND ANSWER THE PHANTOM'S POSTING UNDER "GETTING PAID" |
Roy Cupps
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 4:00 pm: | |
The NACA did have a web site and I had some information about the site and a link to the site listed on the CADO page titled Insurance Links however, I think was about ten months the link went dead and I removed the link from the site.
BTW, I'm taking notes and CADO is gearing for the year 2000 by putting your suggestions into place. At the first of November I upgraded the site again and I feel that we now have the space and features that we need to take us way into next year. The upgrade will allow us take full advantage of the technology that the web has to offer. Of course the way things change on the web, more upgrades and changes will be needed.
I would like to take this time to thank all supports for their support. Also, I appreciate all of the comments that I have heard and read about the site in this last couple of weeks.
More to come.
Roy Cupps |
Tom Joyce
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 1:56 pm: | |
Probably time to move off the NACA issue and work on the new organization that will be able address issues revelant today and into 2000. Those that have been in the business for several years know the changes that have occured and in fact it is not the same profession that it was 10, 15, or 20 years ago. To be able to have any clout in determining our future we as a profession have to be able to go to our customers and not only say, but be able to prove what we can do for them.
Can we go to the customer at this point and say why an adjuster should do an inspection and estimate as opposed to a contractor? Can we show to our customers the benifit to them for incurring service fees, when in their eyes they are getting nothing more that an estimate, photos and maybe and evalutaion, all of which they can get at no cost. Can we show where we can aid in policy interpetation, determining coverages, etc.
Can it be shown that a standardization of fees, file requirements will smooth the process for all involved? Maybe we can, working together. |
Ben Dare
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 1:21 pm: | |
$64,000, it is my understanding that NACA provides transportation, hotel, air fair, meals and other expenses for the NACA officers to attend the annual meetings. This information is from one of the former NACA officers.
Perhaps that answers part of your question at least? |
NACA Member Too
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 1:12 pm: | |
I have a $64,000 question, where does NACA spend 640 x $100.00 in dues. I know my news letter 2 or 3 times a year doesn't run more than 25.00 an issue. |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 12:09 pm: | |
Jim we need to be sure the new organization is viewed as always giving more than it is taking. Maybe the charter should have some provision to see that its mission statement and actions change as required by the industry’s changing needs. Perhaps having to vote on the wording of the mission statement annually would help insure this. If changes in our course are done on a regular bases we will not find ourselves in the current situation. |
Jim Flynt
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 11:51 am: | |
I simply must apologize for overlooking one other benefit of NACA. If you send them your annual dues, they will send you one of their nice little NACA decals to post in the rear window of your vehicle.
Personally, I can think of better ways myself to spend over $100.00 a year. |
Jim Flynt
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 11:48 am: | |
Gale, you ask the question: Where would we be today without NACA?
The answer is quite simple actually.
We would be right where we are now. Disorganized, ineffectual, and seemingly without any sense of direction as to where we are going. We would be without any forum for instant communication, any website, or regular publications, without any purpose other than an annual social gathering.
I agree, let's give NACA credit for THAT.
In the meantime, one can log onto the CADO Page and instantly exchange ideas, seek information concerning relevant topics, and find educational information regarding a wide variety of subjects applicable to our industry.
Please, would someone post the address for the NACA website so we can all see what they are doing for us?
The Best news for adjusters is that CADO costs them nothing while NACA wants your dues for God only knows what in return. |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 11:29 am: | |
Where would we be today w/o NACA? We all are going to age if we live long enough and just because we may no longer want to be it the thick of things does not diminish our lifetime of efforts. NACA will be around as long as it meets needs. Change is a hard thing that more will realize as the current effort moves forward. I am willing to bet that even a few calling for change will get cold feet once they realize change will effect each of us in a way that we may at first resist. NACA is following its mission statement and does not have to change unless the members so decide. NACA and some of its members was a great help to Hawkins Research at a very critical time in our development of PowerClaim and now most of adjusting industry will benefit because NACA was in place and having a positive impact on the industry. |
A NACA Member
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 10:53 am: | |
The last four postings are probably made by the same child. Check the dates. Dummy!
At least some in NACA have class which this little dummy wouldn't understand what it was if it jumped up and bit you know where! |
Naca3
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 9:39 am: | |
Yes, and don't try to call NACA over at the Adjuster's Playhouse Toddler School either. They don't let calls through while they are changing their pants. |
Nacamember2
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 9:32 am: | |
Well at least they can all play shuffleboard on board their cruise ship when they have their next annual convention while they drink Lone Star Beers. |
Doc
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 9:27 am: | |
Just be careful if you try to contact NACA by telephone. They don't allow phone calls to residents of the nursing home during nap time. |
A NACA MEMBER
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 9:13 am: | |
NACA is a social organization. To be fair with them they have done a ton of research on group insurance, and have a relationship with one agent where reasonably priced E & O insurance can be purchased. This is mostly a party organization but maybe that is not so bad either. They have not proported to be at the cutting edge of anything. Their website is now defunct or maybe just off line. Their biggest accomplishment was the trademark of NACA, which by the way if you do a web search with those letters , catastrophe adjusters gets lost in thousands of other organizations using the same ID. I am a member of NACA for me it served as a way to get some education and fullfill the NFIP requirements. I agree with the sentiment that another Professional organization needs to take the lead. This way we won't disturb those in the Great State of Texas that are sleeping on the porch. |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 1999 - 12:20 am: | |
Questioning if Joe spoke for NACA as most other members would my research turned up the fact that there are leaders that have worked unsuccessful to move NACA into the new millennium and that a core group of the founders want it to stay the same as always. As all know Joe Rasco made this clear in one of his post. The big question is if NACA does not plan to be a leader of the current and next generation of adjusters what does it’s future hold? An 180 degree about face and face up to current issues or pass away with those that want no change are the two options I see in NACA future and yet either outcome may be the correct one for NACA. I expect we will have a clear view of which option they have chosen by the time the boat docks back in port but I see the push for CADO continuing full speed ahead without waiting for their decision. Building from ground up is often more successful than remodeling because of the limits set by the first blueprint the builders used. Today change is a way of life more than ever. As painful as it is to lead the change it is still less painful than having to follow the change leader. At least you get to control the changes that occur and do not just have to react to the changes that are out of one’s control. |
R.D. Hood
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 1999 - 10:34 am: | |
SAME OLD STORY!!!!!!!!
Where are all of the proponents of these issues, hiding under a rock???.
What would there be in this wonderful land,(which every other country in the world aspires to emulate) IF it were not for some of the infamous statements of our heritage. "Give me Liberty or give me Death", "Damn the torpedeos, full speed ahead!", "live Free or Die"
What has happened to all of the TRUE Independents, have y'all been so threatened, brainwashed, intimidated, that you can no, longer see the forest for the trees??
WE are the adjusting community, not the vendors, not the carriers. Without an army to lead , where can they go?
We are only asking for respect, the opportunity to earn a decent return on our investment, (in time, education, experience, tools and equipment) as are those that employ us, (or hire us as IC's).
Take the time to analyze the situation.
1) We need the vendors as much as they need us.
2) The carriers need qualified representation.
3) The insured parties need to be treated fairly.
4) Our ranks, of qualified personell, are being
depleted every year.
5) Our educational system, for the trainees is almost non existant.
6) The respect for the trade has diminished considerably, WE even dislike our fellowman.
It is time for some to step up to the plate, take a few swings at the ball and hit a HOMER. If may have to be in the form of a Union (no thanks from my end).
Or perhaps in the form of an organization that represents the "best of the best" which ANY VENDOR or CARRIER would be pleased to hire, knowing that they will be rewarded with the most profitable product in both turnaround and quality.
If no one can see the handwriting on the wall,despite the ramblings and commentary posted herein, then we are indeed entitled to whatever plauge besets ourselves.
PLEASE, GIVE PAUSE TO THE MESSAGES , AND EITHER LEAD, FOLLOW OR GET THE HELL OUT OF THE WAY!!!! |
Evan Black
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 1999 - 10:07 am: | |
That confirms it! Not only is NACA a toothless lion, but gelded and declawed as well.
Ain't it just pathetic! |
Glen Garoutte
| | Posted on Saturday, November 27, 1999 - 9:54 am: | |
Joe I see your point and respect your statement. I see where this thing is going which will be nowhere as usual. The adjusting community will never be a unified organization , and maybe in a sense that is good.
The ones that give a good work product will always be working to where the ones that don't will only work when there arn't enough adjusters to staff a large storm. This will be my last statement on the subject and I wish each and every one that thinks there will ever be a unification in the industry a ton of luck.
I will continue to be one in the field that will always try to help a person in need weather new or old in the industry. It is still a field that we all need to be as helpful in a storm situation with one another as possible.Happy Holidays to each and every one of you. |
Joe W. Rasco
| | Posted on Friday, November 26, 1999 - 11:52 pm: | |
I have just returned from Thanksgiving holidays and I see where this conversation is going.
I am only a member of NACA and cannot speak for the membership. However, if anyone is looking for more than I have mentioned in my previous statements, they simply need to look elsewhere.
Good luck to anyone that thinks someone is going to fend for him or her in this business. After all, why should they? For some in this business, I can see where the words UNION, SOLIDARITY, MUTUAL BENEFITS, NEGOTIATION, AND REPRESENTATION might seem important to them now.
I will be one of the first to state that as an independent, and only I will ever represent my name in negotiations and other representations. Yes, I am INDEPENDENT. I have no use for the words above.
Though we do not think alike, I will watch with great interest from the sideline and I sincerely wish each of those that think otherwise "GOOD LUCK".
PS: Good night, Glen. |
Glen Garoutte
| | Posted on Thursday, November 25, 1999 - 7:16 am: | |
Joe is your organization willing to step up to the plate and address these concerns and others, or do we need to form another organization on our own. You have a name that has been around for 20 years that would make since to have represent the adjusting community,so give us your thoughts. Either we join in as a group and address these issues as a solified group or we put this thing to bed and continue our gripes on CADO. |
R.D. Hood
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 1999 - 11:01 pm: | |
These gentlemen have "cut to the quick" of the matter, and we may be well advised to consider some of the options that their commentary presents.
NACA is 20+ years in existance, and appears to have been based on a social interaction, held on an annual basis, as an original primary objective and also some "business" discussions, (IRS Rules, you see).
Our world is in Y2K, are they? It does not appear so at this time. As Gale stated, information more that 24 hrs old,in the RW (Real World) is old news.
What is the problem with taking an existing organization,and fine tuning it to exist in the RW?
A few years back some folks attempted to start another organization CACEA,as I remember, but that failed for lack of funding (Right again, Dr.)
Much of the distress, that is being voiced on this issue, begs to be answered. Yet no one,or group has offered a creative solution, albight the proposition of a Union. This option has been beaten to death many times over the years.
Having been a union member in the 50's. My take is that it elevates the minimal member and supresses the outstanding member. Like one of the forums recently suggested that a superstar player get paid like the water toter, ain't gonna happen.
A few polls that were placed here and the OVERWHEMING response was to not unionize , but rather to organize. So those that are in tune with the times, have voiced their opinion.
Now, why not get a focus group together, 3-7 qualified, interested, and above all dedicated individuals. Discuss the merits of re-working NACA,consult with their leadership,consider forming another group, etc.
The opportunity is now staring AT YOU. This is the way this can work, CADO is the answer. We can network, have whiteboard discussions, netmeetings, and whatever other fun things that one can conceive.
IMHO, if we do NOT ACT NOW, and take advantage of the latest technology, have a solid game plan , as well as, several alternates, in place before the BIG ONE comes, whatever it may be, we all will feel the reprecussions.
The basics are simple,
1)Our trade needs some form of representation.
2)We must have correct accreditation for ourselves, that the carriers,and vendors can rely upon.
3)Insurances and benefits are requested.
4)Continuing education in the trade and the tools of the trade are mandatory.
Several of the "old dogs" are in accord with this thinking and perhaps we can join together in an atmosphere of solidarity for the mutual benefit of each of the participants.
If anyone wishes to volunteer for the project, please respond, I can wait a few more years, can you???????? |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 1999 - 10:13 pm: | |
Joe I think most will agree that serving as an officer in a non-profit organization is usually a hard and often thankless job. Most will not be willing to work hard enough to start a new association. One way unions survive is a secret to many but it is that they collect dues. They don’t ask you to please send in your money but it is collected upfront. Joe the secret to saving the NACA or starting a new association is money. If someone expects something for nothing they usually get the latter.
I read you mission statement in paragraph 4 and it sounds good. Perhaps if you could post a paragraph below it the explains more in detail how you are going about fulfilling your mission statement some adjusters would not look on the NACA as being history. For the NACA or any other organization to do what is being expected of it will have to have a strong, aggressive staff with a $200-300K budget. What is the budget of NACA? Really Lori can only do so much!
In the paragraph 3 you talk about the NACA like it was meant to be a place were the guys get together once a year to exchange information. In a world were there are gals and information over 24 hours old is often worthless perhaps NACA is not perceived as meeting the goals of its members as it did 20 years ago. It seems you are starting to see the power of this forum and how NACA could have developed into a more responsive organization. When I typed in www.naca.com I got the Neighborhood Assistance Corporation of America that did not start until 1988. When I typed in www.naca.org I got the National Association for Campus Activities. You may have to change the name to be easy to find on the web unless you can grab one of those new suffixes that are up for grabs. Joe this generation just does not wait until once a year to exchange information. Perhaps NACA could merge with a more technology-oriented organization so that the resulting organization could provide best for the industry. I still say that without money it will be hard for any organization to get to far in changing the lives of its members in a positive direction.
Joe it seems clear that the “Union” idea was dead on arrival but that there is a real demand for a professional organization that can cut the mustard. I would like to make the NACA Convention but do not want to be on a ship that long with my physical limitations but once the ship sails the leadership will have a captive audience. It would seem like a good time to discuss NACA’s future in the industry and start it on the road to recovery so there will not be talk of starting another organization or decide to kill NACA if the membership deems best.
Joe why you are not proud enough of NACA to “Plug NACA”? I plug PowerClaim ever chance I get even if it is not the best for everyone needs today because I know what PowerClaim is in the process of becoming. Just because someone plugs another brand does not bother me if it is without reason but if it is with reason I go to work fixing PowerClaim so it will not be a valid reason next time the person makes the same statement. NACA has a proud history and can still cut the mustard if it so desires but its time to decide to fix itself may be getting short. Joe plug NACA with all of your strength and help change what needs changing. If I say nothing about PowerClaim needs changing and you say nothing about NACA needs changing the rest will just smile and politely ignore the both of us. |
Glen Garoutte
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 1999 - 1:18 pm: | |
Joe I have a couple of questions for your organization:
1If your chapter promotes the general welfare of the adjuster, then why do the vast majority of us continue to finance these storms while we wait until the company gets paid?
2. Why have the fee schedules continued to not rise with the costs of living, our expenses continue to rise. we wait on our money for longer than we should, and continuosly we have to fight for the holdback?
3. Why has there not been a group insurance offered at an affordable price for the independants?
4. Is there someone in your organization that will stand up for the vast majority of us that just want a fair shake out there.
I personally don't think that anyone is out to get the vendors nor the carriers, but they have to realize that we have expenses also. I would like to see how many of the vendors and carriers are willing to come to your 5 day class and discuss some of these issues with some sincerity.
When the carriers need to raise their rates for whatever reason , do they not do so. I really don't think a vast majority of the adjuster community cares for a union, but I do believe we want an organization that will take notice and stand in there for whats right. I have great respect for the vendors and the carriers as they have to make a profit, but so do we. In due time this thing will explode in someones face and the really experienced will not show up for a major disaster. |
JOE W. RASCO
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 1999 - 10:22 am: | |
RE: NACA QUESTION FROM GALE HAWKINS
Your question is answered in my 4th paragraph.
Perhaps you are saying if a union is what the men are after, NACA was not organized for that purpose which is correct. |
Gale Hawkins
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 1999 - 2:27 am: | |
Joe what is the mission statement of NACA? |
JOE W. RASCO
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 23, 1999 - 4:26 pm: | |
IS THERE A NEED FOR ANOTHER ASSOCIATION AND IF SO, WHY?
There have been several postings about starting up another association along with questions about the original intent for starting NACA. Perhaps there is a need that I am not seeing. Believe me, it is not an easy process to get an association started and to get to where NACA is today.
As a charter member and past president of NACA, I will attempt to answer some of the questions and what the intent is of this organization.
NACA was originally organized for the sole purpose of a brotherhood type association to get together once a year and exchange information as to changes in our field as well as who we worked for the past year and to stay informed as to fee schedules, who paid in a timely manner, and who didn't pay what we felt the adjuster had coming, and etc. We could then form our individual opinions as to whether we wished to work with certain firms. Before long, we knew something about all the different firms and insurance companies that hired independent storm adjusters and knew before they called if we wanted to work for them. THE INTENT WAS NEVER TO TRY TO UNIONIZE.
For those of you that do not know, NACA is a non-profit organization dedicated to the adjustment of losses arising from hurricane, hail, tornado, flood, earthquake and other catastrophes. It was organized in 1976 and is dedicated to improving professional stdandards, insuring working relations with one another and promoting the general welfare of the individual members. The Association is 625 members strong including 58 associate business members and 43 associate members.
NACA meets with a convention every January for four of five days, which usually includes a golf tournament and continued education classes that most can get credit in their home state toward their adjuster's license. There are usually some highly qualified speakers invited. E&O and group medical insurance is also available.
Anyone interested should contact LORI RINGO, STAFF ASSISTANT; P. O. BOX 821864; NORTH RICHLAND HILLS, TEXAS 76182 (817) 498-3466
I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS AN ANSWER OR NOT TO MOST AND I REALLY DON'T MEAN TO PLUG NACA, BUT WANTED THOSE THAT MAY NOT BE AWARE TO KNOW THERE ALREADY IS A PROFESSIONAL ASSOCIATION ORGANIZED FOR CATASTROPHE ADJUSTERS. |
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