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Clayton Carr (Clayton)
Posted on Saturday, November 17, 2001 - 11:46 am:   

Mike, I have noted your post in this forum and two other forums today.

You bring to this web site your four shingled handle of being a Public Adjuster, while being an Independent Adjuster, while being an Insurance Consultant, while being a licenced Broker; while still doing some cat work.

With all that you comment that there is little work, and solicit ideas from "us". With your coverage of the insurance marketplace niches, I can not imagine how 'quiet' or 'slow' it would have to be; to not be reasonably busy at one if not two of your pursuits.

With a little bit of your free time, aside from answering Ghost's question; could you visit the "Could / should CADO evolve" forum and some of the other current forums seeking opinions and ideas, and favor us with your comments?
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2001 - 9:09 pm:   

I am a Public Adjuster located in PA.
I am also an Independent Adjuster who does local claims and CAT work when needed.
Things are real dry here in PA. Very little work.
Any ideas??
Would like to hear from you.
I can be contacted @
Chuck Deaton
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2001 - 8:32 am:   

Cat 102 remains free for the asking. Just email me and ask.
Kile Anderson (Kileanderson)
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2001 - 12:50 am:   

Here's an interesting question that has occured to me on several occasions. I have never been a staff or company adjuster. The only adjusting work I've ever done is cat work. I had a friend that started in cat with me and then, when the work dried up in 99-2000 he took a job with an adjusting firm as a full time staff adjuster. Worked local claims, company car, company computer and digi-cam. He slept at home every night and made just enough money to keep him coming in every day (wearing a tie no less), but not enough to really be happy. He would, quite often, handle 1, 2 or maybe 3 claims in a week. Usually very simple claims, tree branch falling on a roof, motorist backing his car into a garage door, toilet overflowed, that kind of stuff. Some times he would handle 10 claims in a week, half of them below deductible, but that was rare. Simply put, he bacame a better computer solitaire player than an adjuster. Eventually he quit out of boredom. Don't worry, hail returned to the midwest this year and he's doing fine now. What I really want to know is how many claims does your average staff adjuster handle in a week in a medium sized city (500,000 people)?
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 10:05 pm:   

I expected your experienced criticisms. Nevertheless, Jim and others, my experiences were my experiences. Nobody taught me how to be a cat adjuster. Noboby "showed me the ropes" in a manner of speaking. It always seemed to me that the cat adjusters that I met were self-interested for the reasons that I could not fully understand, and I could not get that compact knowledge of success and survival that I had sought. After working in the business for 10 years, I realized that there was a form of success and survival. It has to do with the old argument about form and function: Which comes first? The scholastics called it "objective reality". (I can hear the accusation of "Dean of Education", now.) But, hear me out! There is a terrific form about mediation that applies superbly in catastrophe adjusting. That is the form part. (Just a little bit to entice you.) What about the success part? Well, I claim that you can be very successful in terms of dollars in cat adjusting, provided you think in terms of form and implement (function) the form to action. What is the form? I do not want to tell all you experienced cat adjusters what to do. I want to teach inexperienced adjusters and other occupations, who are interested, how to start in catastrophe adjusting and survive and succeed in a compact lesson, just when they need it. By the way, I have been to the professional adjuster schools. I know that you know that these schools teach adjusters to be "company" adjusters. You know what mean! "Company" adjusting schools are good schools in their own right, but they do not address form and they definitely do not address how to make money. They address good adjusting process and quality adjusting and function. There is a surprising difference between the adjusting school and my catastrophe adjusting school. For example, a good friend of mine in the insurance claims industry (doing very well, by the way), made an interesting comment about catastrophe adjusters. He said that the best adjusters gravitate to catastrophe adjusting. Keep measuring up all you wannabees! This friend had never done cat adjusting. Hey, if better education is needed at this time in this industry, why not present a different type of school? I do not mean to make you bite at the bit as to what this school is about. The form is mediate your way with people to success. It is constant, for sure. It is good advice for a new man or woman starting out, specifically, in catastrophe adjusting. This form is explained in detail, of course, in the course. No pun intended. Jim, you do not have to attend my course, but if you attend mine, I will attend yours. Thanks for your criticisms.
been there
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 2:49 pm:   

I say therefore I am. This seems to be appropriate in the Cat Adjusting proffesion. It is entirely possible to put on a seminar with valuable information, for a reasonable fee and point people in the direction of the vendors. Personally I think it is an interesting niche to be filled.
As for the, designations,certificates, the insurance industry has been doing it for years.
Hope everyone has a nice Thanksgiving :)
alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 2:41 pm:   

The web site also says they can teach you everything you need in one class. Wish they would have had something like this 15 to 20 years ago. Think of all the grief we could have saved ourselves. I might attend just to see this marvel of modern education. Maybe I'll bring the Dean of my Law School. We might be able to condense a 3 year J.D. program into a month.
alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 2:35 pm:   

Only if plaintiff hires lawyer based upon certain repersentations. I refer you to the cat-adjuster school web site. Look at the promises etc.. that are made. Class taught by a vetern 10 yr cat adjuster on top of that. Wonder what cats they have worked?
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 2:16 pm:   

So Alan, if a plaintiff hires an attorney who then loses his lawsuit, would the plaintiff have a cause of action against the lawyer? And would the attorney then in fact be able to go back and sue his legal alma mater for damages and recovery of his law school tutition for not providing a comprehensive effective education?

Interesting legal theory, that shucks, I never thought of until you brought it up.

And isn't it true under law, that for every 'winner' in litigation, there also has to be a 'loser'?
alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 12:05 pm:   

If I send my money to the dean of the cat school and attend the class. Is there an implied warranty that I will learn enough or become a cat adjuster? If I pass the class and never find employment, do I have a cause of action? I like others would most certainly rely upon the repersentations made on their web site as the basis of paying my tuition and attending the class.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on the matter.
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 7:34 am:   

O.K., I will take the heat and my "real" email is posted.
To 'get' an Adjuster license in most any states, is very easy, fill out the application,sometimes take a test and file a bond of some sort.
To become licensed in Texas, you can set up a time to take the test at any 'in-state' university, it concerns insurance terms and other things and is not real easy, but with a background in insurance (any kind) you can pass it.
Also in Texas, if you want to be a licensed trainee adjuster in the state of texas, give me a call.
but 'most' 'cat' adjusters I have met, went to some kind of Leonards institute of Insurane. They have a few and you go for 1/2 day of General insurance on Monday, and Tue-wed-thur- and 1/2 day of Friday and then a test. they send your paperwork to Austin and bam you are a catagory 4 license insurance adjuster in the great state of texas.then keep your 30 hours of C.E., more than lawyers or any other well know profession. and bang you continue to be one.
I noted on Iacobum's page that he gives a class and tells you how to get license in Florida and then submit to state for temporary license and 'go' to work, now really mr. iacobum it ain't that easy to just go to florida and pick up claims, Is it?
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 8:16 am:   

Tom, you would only flunk the application exam if your answer to the question, Define the Great Lakes, is '5 large inland bodies of water', instead of the correct answer: who is the best storm manager in America!

On the other hand, Jim Lakes writes the test, and I am only allowed to grade 'em.
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 1:56 am:   

'iacobum': How would you see a catastrophe school as being different than an adjusting school? Especially an adjusting school which emphasizes property loss estimating, claims handling techniques and policy knowledge and interpretation?

Just what is it that you would teach differently in your catastrophe school? How would you envision the curriculums as being different?
What would the cost to the student be for your class and would your class provide any accepted certification or acknowledged designation?

Any form of education which improves our working knowledge base of insurance in any of it's many forms is a well needed and welcome asset to the insurance industry.

Thanks in advance for any insight and additional information you can provide CADO readers.
Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2001 - 10:12 pm:   

Not an adjuster school, but a cat adjuster school. There's a difference. I have started one, and, frankly, I have met no one, so far, who is using the same methodology. See my website as follows: It is outdated right now because of other business that I am doing, but I still get calls about it. In fact, one other company is very interested in making a deal with me. Why? Because there are people who are interested in knowing how to get started in catastrophe adjusting. Yes, education! Good idea. Gentlemen and ladies, if you want to attend my course, just let me know. People from Alaska have even called me. Can you believe that! Of course, Alaska is quite a distance from South Florida, but an on-line course is doable. I thank you in advance for all your criticisms.
Posted on Wednesday, November 14, 2001 - 1:13 am:   

A suggestion, New Mexico is not a bad state to have 'a " license in. they are reciprocal and not a 'big' problem if 'you' have another license.
just a thought. also, the great George Leonards of Dallas and other areas, have a 4 to 5 day school to 'spoon' feed you for your license if necessary.
Now, Jim, if you and Lakes are already flunking people, darn, I can't even pass the application!!
you guys are tough, tuff, toff, and tiffer or whatever, do not grade me on this post!! O:}

Tom S

Be glad to help any way possible
Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2001 - 10:58 am:   


Mr. Flynt is correct in what reciprocity means. Florida and Michigan are also recprocal with MS but Michigan will not accept it (or in the past have not) because it is not your home state. You will find that most licensing states except for NV and NY are recprocal with any state that tests. The AIC and CPCU designation is generally accepted in place of passing an exam in most states that require licensing.

I would suggest getting you license in TX and MI as soon as possible. Texas because of the enormous amout of work there that doesn't fall under emergency licensing provisions but are cat-coded by the companies. I would suggest Michigan because they do not have any emergency provisions in the state law. If I can be of any further assistance please contact me at 888-544-5500.
Posted on Tuesday, November 13, 2001 - 8:25 am:   

This sounds great to me. Please incude me in your class.
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Monday, November 12, 2001 - 8:54 am:   

Kile, Thanks for your kind comments about the AIC ~ CADO class, and I will be posting more details later today about this idea.

Kile, generally speaking, what reciprocity means is that if you obtain a license in one state which has reciprocity with another state, you can get a license in the second state without taking or having to pass the licensing exam in the 2nd state. You would still have to fill out the appropriate paperwork and pay a licensing fee, but would not be required to take an exam in the additional state.

I am not sure whether the rule still applies or not, but just a few years ago, you could also obtain both a Texas and an Oklahoma resident and non-resident's adjuster license without taking the license exams in those two states if you had earned the AIC or CPCU designation. Several states do not require licensing exams for those holding the CPCU designation.

I'll do a little more research on the Mississppi ~ Texas relationship and report back to you on their requirements.
Kile Anderson (Kileanderson)
Posted on Sunday, November 11, 2001 - 11:59 pm:   

I think it's a great idea Jim, count me in.

I have a few questions I hope some of you can answer. You can answer them here or email them to me. I live in Louisiana where no license is required for adjusters. Over the past 3 years I've worked in Maryland, Delaware, Indiana, Missouri, Texas, West Virginia and Louisiana. In all states I've worked under emergency license when needed. I'm planning to take the Mississippi licensing exam (next month I hope) I've been told that it is reciprocal with TX. Does this mean that I will be issued a TX license upon presenting my MS. license or does it just mean that because I'm licensed in MS I'm allowed to work in TX? Also, does anyone know what other states are reciprocal with MS? If I get a license in TX with my MS lic, will I then also be able to get lic. in all states reciprocal with TX? And, last but not least, has anyone taken the MS test and can they tell me what to expect? Thanks in advance for any help on these questions.
Russ Doe
Posted on Sunday, November 11, 2001 - 6:09 pm:   

Count me in!!!
alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Sunday, November 11, 2001 - 3:17 pm:   


You just had the best idea that I have heard in a long time. I'll have my J.D. in May. Two more classes. Let me know if I can help in any way.
Ghostbuster (Ghostbuster)
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 8:11 pm:   

Readin' an ritin' an rithmetic, taught to the tune of Hickory stick.

So, like, duhhh, who do I give this half eaten apple to?
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 6:39 pm:   

I would like to get my designation. Being able to do it online sounds like a fine idea to me. Count me in.
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 2:22 pm:   

Roy and Jim,

Count me in , but do you really think it will take 24 months to complete ?
Tom Joyce (Tomj)
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 1:42 pm:   

Just a quick note, Clayton has provided some avenues for us to follow up on.
How many professions require an individual to serve so many masters?
Please give it some thought and respond with the consideration of all cat people in mind.
I will follow up with my thoughts shortly.
Suggestion, let us leave fee and wages out of this one.
Clayton Carr (Clayton)
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 1:10 pm:   

Prior to Jim's last post, I again felt the urge to comment. "Wong Whey for sure" (no offense D. Wong, but I couldn't resist) - when Alan created this thread I recognized the satirical humour of his thoughts. Then "been there" enters with a comment on a sad story; which quickly escalates to more swill throwing.

When D. Wong cries out loud about his perceived lack of empathy and his negative emotion for the plight of others - I suggest to you all that those are not the traits that adjusters will build any meaningful longevity into their careers with. Hence, I believe it is "the wrong way".

The issues and relevance to adjusting of "empathy" (identifying yourself mentally with another person and understanding that person) or "emotion" (a strong feeling in the mind), to me are two of the numerous critical factors in an adjuster's ability to deal effectively and properly - with our customer's customer - the insured.

Without a strong measure of empathy and controllable emotion - how do we recognize the trauma (a shock that produces a lasting effect on a person's mind) of an insured when we need their attention and eventual agreement, concerning their loss? Yes, a lot of losses are very straightforward; but there is more to adjusting than the amount of lumber, roofing or drywall.

We are strangers in an insured's "home", whose goal it is to demonstrate our willingness to help them determine the measure of their loss. Is it not Pilot, who sings the virtues of the "4E's" - empathy, expectation, explanation, education? If we become insulated (due to repetition or sterotyping) from the environment in which we work, how will we be able to effectively deal with an insured?

Our "product" is our service. All the things that come first to your mind regarding "what I do as a cat adjuster" are merely aspects of the "job"; they are tasks - cause determination, coverage analysis, scoping, measuring, estimating, phone calls, reporting, etc etc - things you must successfully accomplish to do your real "job" - provide a service to a customer.

One of your best characteristics for this job, is your ability to listen. If you listen carefully to an insured, you will get a clear understanding of the issues relating to their attitude. With a strong measure of empathy and controlled emotion, I feel it is beneficial to acknowledge an insured's feelings - I see nothing wrong with genuinely telling an insured the likes of "I'm sorry for what has happened to you".

I suggest that once you have established that you understand what the insured is feeling and why, only then will the insured really accept what you have to say on a technical or factual level.
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 12:21 pm:   

CADO ~ AIC Online Classes

Alan, I do like your idea of furthering knowledge for adjusters and a school more focused on education than making money would hold great appeal to me, as well as to others.

Stay tuned.

On Monday, I will unveil an idea with details for what I'm going to call the CADO ~ AIC Online (Designation) Classes.

Basically, we could have a weekly online class for those members or guests who would like to either earn this recognized designation or perhaps who are only interested in taking the property module. If we can interest 15-30 folks interested in this, we could make it interesting as well as fun. The only cost for those interested will be the cost of the AIC textbooks and the AIC exam for those wanting to follow through with earning the designation, and perhaps a small charge to cover whatever expenses Roy might incur in setting up the extra pages on the board which these classes might require.

I'll be happy to write the weekly online lesson plans as well as weekly quizzes to monitor progress and mentor those enrolled. We could even set up a closed chat for those participating in this class here on CADO and a closed Forum just for those enrolled. We can start with the AIC Property class and then move along into the other 3 modules of Worker's Comp, Liability, and The Claims Environment. Within a period of less than 24 months or 4 'semesters', we could thus add another 25 or so adjusters to our CADO ranks holding this designation.

Anyone have any ideas or thoughts about this? It just seems to me that this could be a valuable learning experience as well as designation of professional success for our newer adjusters as well as some old timers.

We just might be able to get Jim Lakes and Russ Lott to finally break down and earn this long overdue designation. They could easily teach it, but need to take the national exams to show the the IIA/CPCU folks they know their stuff. I'm sure there are many others similarly situated.

More on Monday!
D Wong Whey (Dwongwhey)
Posted on Saturday, November 10, 2001 - 1:55 am:   

Hey "been" I'm a cat adjuster for crying out loud not a friggin social worker. Sounds like you need to consider a job change to social work. We are all drowning in your tears.
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 10:37 pm:   

d wong whey:
hope you don't have to watch it happen to someone - it sucks.
D Wong Whey (Dwongwhey)
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 4:39 pm:   

"been there" ~ Let me get this straight: your waitress/adjuster lost her 'life savings' and she only lost $1,000.00 (a thousand smackers)?

She must have not had much of a life now did she?
been there
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 12:14 pm:   


your class is a dollar less than what nca was charging - watched them take a waitress's last 1000.00 - gave her ten claims - sent her home. she lost her life savings and had to leave the site because she wasn't a good "adjuster". wonder why. but i bet nca had golf money for a couple of days. all true seen by other "adjusters".
Chuck Deaton
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 4:21 pm:   

Cat 102 remains free for the time it takes to email me.

Also the Disto Loan Out program is working. In order to try a Disto just email me and I will put your name on my list.
Kile Anderson (Kileanderson)
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 2:01 pm:   

Thanks for letting us know you were joking Alan. The way things have been going, I think alot of us thought, hey, maybe that would work. Things are mighty lean right now. Nothing involving making money can be ruled out.
Jim Flynt (Jimflynt)
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 7:47 am:   

There is no real money in educating others. Real wealth comes from educating ourselves.

The real purpose and goal of CADO is to share wealth by a sharing of knowledge and information.

alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Friday, November 09, 2001 - 7:18 am:   

I was trying to be funny. Looks like I missed the mark.

Sorry gang.
alan jackson (Ajackson)
Posted on Thursday, November 08, 2001 - 7:20 pm:   

I'm thinking we need a 3 day school. Maybe $999.99 for the entire course. Of course this does not include the nightly 3 hour review course taught my Jim. (Hope we can talk him into it) We can charge and extra $300.00 for this. We'll all call a few of our buddies at vendors. Get them to show up and take a few applications and smile. Give them free refreshments and golf for their effort. For an additional $1450.00 we can throw in a one day mold certification. Our vendor buddies will tell the recruits how important being mold certified is to being employed on a Big Cane. At lunch we can take turns telling how much money we made working, Hugo, Andrew and the big EQ. We'll call Gale and his fellow software vendors to show up give their much needed spill. I can get one of my lawyer buddies to show up and talk about the importance of properly evaluating the loss and applying contract law to such things.

It's been slow folks, Maybe we can make a few bucks.

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