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Claimsranger/Andrew Sloane
Posted on Friday, August 24, 2001 - 9:57 am:   

Sharlene, is the tub enclosure ceramic tile? Is the floor vinyl? or is it a unit, ie. shower/tub combo made of fiberglass? Let me know and I may be able to give you a small start in a direction that may help.
Tom Toll (Tom)
Posted on Friday, August 24, 2001 - 8:50 am:   

The following is an excellent site for wood shingles and shakes. Pull it up, print all of it and keep it with you to show the roofers what hail damage is on wood and that it is repairable.
Posted on Friday, August 24, 2001 - 6:49 am:   

Just my 2 cents worth, 1st cent, HAAG is NOT the end all be all on any kind of roof. I'll check my Rolodex and post the "Roof Guru" who is. He advises Haag. 2nd cent, with one exception in Cape Girtadeau MO. I have never dealt with or met a single engineer. PE of course; that has ever swung a hammer for a living in nearly 30 years in construction, teaching it and Adjusting claims, argued with quite a few. Give 'em books, send them to school and what do you have? Especially one of them in Goldsboro NC (Franover a smell, much like another post. ($6K for a report that said nothing) and less than $300 to settle the loss on the vinyl floor in a bathroom, another $2500 tacked on for the ALE! I am a staunch advovate of learning, schools and certifications. Get them in your down time. Also try snd obtain a copy of National Construction Estimator, CD or the hard copy like Linda has. Cheaper than HAAG and it has EVERY type of roof in it! Nuff said. Hi Linda! Call me when you get a chance. By the way, Add Ray King and Leo Walter to the list of the best. IMHO
Posted on Friday, August 24, 2001 - 12:03 am:   

Okay people. Have a question for you mold experts. Have been seeing mold on tub enclosures (lack of maintenance) walls next to ac's etc. Normal mold smell. We all know the mold smell. But today have condo in Vegas that is claimed as non-liveable. Attorneys involved of course. I walked in totally skeptical expecting the same old same old. Got hit in the face by a toxic odor that you couldn't breathe. Sharp and bitter. Eyes, nose, throat, chest stung. Skin stung. Got a headache a little later and the taste and smell are still with me. Had a tear gas claim once and this was more like that. Anybody know of a mold that causes a toxic gas like that? Or maybe remediation technique gone wrong that could cause this severe a reaction? My other thought is that this building owned by one family became an unwanted place to live and somebody set off a canister of some kind of noxious gas. Anyone with any experience with this nasty a mold or gas-let me know at my email. Thanks. Still trying to breathe Sharlene in Las Vegas-home of the mold litigation stampede.
Jpt (Jpt)
Posted on Monday, October 02, 2000 - 8:19 pm:   

Rick Brooks,

E-mail me reference to the asbestos slates in New Orleans.

Rick Brooks
Posted on Saturday, September 30, 2000 - 4:00 pm:   

Can someone verify the current replacement pricing for the asbestos tiles in New Orleans? I have a few claims for a small carrier and have not been able to network with other carriers or adjusters. I have received an engineer report from a roofer. The word is most major carriers are now replacing instead of repairing the tile roofs. Please e-mail any information.
Posted on Saturday, September 30, 2000 - 7:09 am:   

Hail Hail da BANGS all here is the title of an article with numerous photos showing hail damage to vegetation, the lovely gardens and structures of New Orleans during the January 23, 2000 hailstorm there. It has wonderful photography as well as delightful music and it can be found at the following web location:
Jim (Jim)
Posted on Saturday, September 30, 2000 - 7:02 am:   

A premier hailstorm website complete with some unbelievable photos of hail and hailstorms can be found at:
Jim (Jim)
Posted on Saturday, September 30, 2000 - 7:00 am:   

An excellent general article about slate and slate roofing, including comments about hail damage to slate roofing can be found at the following web location:
Whitey (Whitey)
Posted on Friday, September 29, 2000 - 11:26 pm:   

Regarding the question on hail damage to slate roofs. Generally speaking hail damage to a slate roof is fairly evident. Unlike comp shingles, which can be bruised, the slate cannot. Unlike wood, which can be dented and suffer no damage, slate cannot be dented. If the hail is of sufficient force to damage the slate, you will have broken pieces either in the center or at the edges of the slate shingle. Older slate will oxidize as well as allow a light covering of mold or moss. The hail can and does knock the oxidation off causing an area to look new or freshly exposed. Repairs can be made to slate as they are generally hung with two hangers or nails and the individual slate shingles are predrilled with the holes. Cost can run anywhere from 5.00 to 25.00 per tile, depending on the amount involved. A good rule for a minimum is $250.00. Your local area will determine the cost per tile.

I don't have any photos of a damaged slate roof in file. I know there are slate roofs in texas, possibly one of the adjusters who have worked the numerous storms will be able to help.

Bottom line, the shingle will either be cracked or broken. If cracked there should be evidence of a direct hit, such as you would find on a wood shingle with a hail indent on top of the fresh crack. Again, the new crack will appear new and not have any weathering, oxidation or mold or moss in the crack. Hope this helps.
Jimlakes (Jimlakes)
Posted on Thursday, September 28, 2000 - 3:24 pm:   

Before I could give you advice on this subject I would perfer to have more information. The Appr process is a little more conclusive than an adjustment. If you wish to give me a call I would be happy to share my thoughts with you since I have been involved in hundreds of Appr processes.
Jim Lakes
National Catastrophe Director
RAC Adjustments, Inc
Jim (Jim)
Posted on Thursday, September 28, 2000 - 5:30 am:   

I received the following email from a CADO reader asking for help and advice. I post it here for the response of our CADO "pros."

Subj: Hail - Slate Roofs
Date: 9/28/00 4:22:05 AM Central Daylight Time
To: JFlynt0007


Thought I'd drop a note off to you for your advice or thoughts. I'm an independent up in WNY and I'm involved in a disputed claim as an appraiser. The claim is for hail damage to a slate roof. The roof is old and in poor shape. Have you seen hail damage to slate roofs, this storm was not a big'en with some damage evident to comp. roof surfaces, metal snow slides & minor siding damage. Any photos of prior losses for slate roofs?

Just a shot out to the claims community for some ideas. Anything you have would be appreciated.


Linda (Linda)
Posted on Saturday, August 26, 2000 - 4:35 pm:   

According to the course description, the "built up" is included in the Commercial Roof course but may be taken by itself without the other commercial roof applications.

If you select the Commercial Roof Course, then you will be taking the built up along with the others.
Jim Flynt
Posted on Saturday, August 26, 2000 - 11:37 am:   

For more information concerning the Haag Engineering classes on commercial roofs, built-up roofs, and other structural seminars follow this weblink to the Haag Engineering website:
David P Bennett (Whitey)
Posted on Saturday, August 26, 2000 - 10:44 am:   

Commercial Roofs vs Built Up Roofs. As suggested give a HAAG a call and see what is covered in each. Only speculation but Built up roofing in and of itself is a full course because of its nature. Built up roofing can be anywhere from a cap sheet over asphalt to 3,4,5 plys of felt, with a 30 lb base and 15lb layers, with a smooth finish to a gravel finish and is applied on both residential and commerical buildings.

Commercial Roofs, I would speculate, deal with larger quantities, built up roofing, edpm roofing, elastomeric roofing, tile roofing, rigid sheating, metal roofs (including standing seam), sprayed roofs, application over wood decks, metal decks, wood framing, metal framing, lightweight concrete decking etc. Would also be dealing with more items on the roof surface, e.g. ac pads, cooler pads, electrical conduit, drainage systems etc.

As to which one to take, would probably depend on what type of claim you intend on handling Personal lines vs Commercial lines.

Best Bet, call Haag and get the information as to the contents of each course.

David Bennett
Dave (Dave)
Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2000 - 11:14 pm:   

Suggest you call the vendor as suggested. The type and specs of commercial roofing are as varied as they can be.

BUR (Built up roofing) comes in Coal Tar Pitch, Asphalt, and even in a sprayed emulsion (GAF).
And within these categories there are many specifications, including but not limited to aggregate (various types) surfaced, smooth surfaced, and they can be 2/3/4/5 ply.

The understanding of BUR will take many years to fully comprehend.

Wish you luck, we all can always learn.
Russ Doe
Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2000 - 5:16 pm:   

A built up roof could be a 4 ply or 5 ply (FHA) roof consisting of layers of asphalt or fiberglass sheets layered in with an asphalt tar. A commercial roof in most cases will have a fire rating and have a fire rated foam under the tar and asphalt. It has to be screwed down to the roof deck with large screws and washers. All roofs are subject to local codes for the type and use of a building! Please BE SAFE and have a great day!
Ricvitiello (Ricvitiello)
Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2000 - 1:33 pm:   

There are many types of commercial roofing (eg: BUR, Modified Bitumen, metals, many single plies such as EPDM rubber, several thermoplastics and thermosets and even sprayed PUF. There many types and variations of built-up roofing. I would suppose that Haag has broken it out as a sub-category of its own because of these many variations but I would suggest a phone call to Haag to see which course would apply most to your interests.

Jim (Jim)
Posted on Tuesday, August 22, 2000 - 10:28 am:   

I received the following email from a CADO reader and wonder if anyone knows why Haig separates built-up roofs from commercial roofs in their seminars? Perhaps some of our readers who have attended both could respond? Thanks for your input for this reader's question.

Subj: Haag Certification
Date: 8/22/00 7:13:44 AM Central Daylight Time

I will be attending Haag Engineering for certification. What is the difference between Commercial Roofs and Built up roofs? I thought BUR was the Commercial Roofs. I have to choose between the two or take both courses at 120 bucks each.
What do you recommend??
I have heard that you and Roy were the best of the best.
Thank you----Bruce

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