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Subject: Camera Purchase???
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GW MocoUser is Offline

Member
Posts:38


12/18/2007 1:37 PM  

I am looking for opinions on the purchase of a new camera. Since beginning i have always used a digital point and shoot type camera ($130.00 panasonic), however i have never been satisfied with its inability to take good overall shots of rooms and roofs. I am not really up to par on cameras, but i have been researching the purchase of a new one and from what i have observed so far i am leaning towards a digital slr camera. The features i am specifically wanting or as follows.

(1) I do not want to spend more than $550-$600 max on one.

(2) In this price range what is a good overall camera (slr digital) ? What are you guys using, and happy with?

(3) Is the 18-50 mm lens standard on new purchase, and does it take good overall view shots ? What is the best zoom for overall capture?

(5) Is the slr memory card adaptable for quick dowload?

(6) Does the slr display the view of capture on the lcd screen prior to the shot, or only through the view finder?

(7) Are there any specific maintenance requirements for the slr?

 

Jud GardnerUser is Offline

Daphne, AL
Member
Posts:136


12/18/2007 3:45 PM  

I've had a dslr camera for about a year so far and plan to take a community college course to learn how to better use it.  My patience is running thin after reading through my second how-to book.  I never planned on using it for work, but for family photos and scenery.

Bringing a dslr (digital single lens reflex- I assume you mean digital as "slr" refers to film) camera to handle property inspections could be overkill unless you are doing some specialized investigations that require a higher level of photography.  This is due to both the cost of the camera and its cumbersome size.  Granted, your price range will put you right within the smaller dslr's, but they are still very large compared to your average point and shoot camera. 

The 18-50 mm lens is small, but a great place to start if you still plan to use it for adjusting. 

Memory card- it just depends on what camera you get.  You may need to get an adapter so that your card will fit in your computer or just use the usb cable that comes with your camera.  Again, the file size of your photos should be very small anyway, so quick downloading is like anything else once you have the proper adapters.

You must use the view finder to view the photo prior to snapping the button.  The dslr viewfinder will show the picture on the viewfinder ONLY until after the picture is taken.  No slr camera does this because the image is being shown on a mirror and through the viewfinder.  If you take your eye off of the viewfinder, more light comes through and can affect the resulting image.  This can be good depending on your desired effect.  Too many factors come into play once you punch the button; shutter speed, aperture size, flash setting, iso, etc.  With a dslr, you have an automatic feature that works some of the time, but the camera expects you to know which setttings and when to use them.

Maintenance requirements, not really.  Yet, if you plan to sort through several lenses throughout your inspection, you will expose the innards to dust and that dust may end up on your mirror.  If that happens, you need to get a special kit to clean it or take it to the store.

My suggestion, get a wide angle lens that will attach to your point and shoot camera which will allow you to take great overall pictures.  This solution will cost between 80-150 bucks.  You'll likely need an adapter.  Armed with the macro feature (high detail in close up shots) and a wide angle lens, you can't get much better than that since practical measures only allow us to send photos in an extremely small file size (usually no more than 300 mb).

In conclusion, by the time you butcher the file size of your Ansel Adams masterpeices to fit in your estimating software or to send through email, the resulting image will be equal what you can get from your average point and shoot models.

Bob HarveyUser is Offline
Gold Member
California, Central Coast
Member
Posts:388


12/18/2007 4:26 PM  

I agree with Jud, the SLR type digitals are a lot more "bulk" than your really need these days. We used the old 35mm film SLR's for years, hanging off our necks like a brick. I love them, but will reach for my little pocket sized digital first.  I will buy a digital SLR one of these days - but just because I am a camera geek.

If I had to buy a new camera today, my first choice would be the small Canon digital Elph SD800. (follow that link to check it out).  It is one of the  "Elph" models that has a wide angle lens, most of them don't.

Nikon has several models with a wide zoom, one of them is very affordable and was just released: the Nikon Coolpix P50 that goes from 28-102 and it is only $189 at Amazon.  It uses AA batteries

Posted By GW Moco on 12/18/2007 1:37 PM

(3) Is the 18-50 mm lens standard on new purchase, and does it take good overall view shots ? What is the best zoom for overall capture?

Do you realize those numbers stand for "focal length"?  If you have worked with the old 35mm film cameras before, the lens you refer to would be "equivalent" to a 28-90 zoom, which is a great lens for adjusting work. The wide angle is important - for me it is more important than the magnification at the full zoom. I want the wide angle so I can show the full bathroom, small kitchen - rather than just one wall.

If you shoot with the old film cameras, the 35mm film is 35mm tall as explained on this site. The imaging sensor is SMALLER on most digital cameras, some of the professional models use a digital imaging device the same size as 35mm film.

Because most digital cameras have very small digital imaging sensors, the relationship of the lens to the imaging sensor is different than 35mm film cameras.

For an explanation, here is something I posted on another thread

I have a multitude of Canon lenses I use for my 35MM Canon Rebel. They will work on the new digital camera.

Yep, they fit and work, but there is a conversion factor that happens because the imaging device on the digital camera is smaller than the old 35mm film negative. If you put a 28mm wide angle lens on, it acts like a 45mm lens.  There is a 1.6 conversion factor for most digital SLR's (Single Lens Reflex).

If money is no object, there is a Canon EOS with an imaging sensor the same size as 35mm film, but still very expensive. They will keep coming down in price though.  If I had to buy a digital SLR today, I would buy the same camera you are talking about but get the lens made for it,

Available only in the Digital Rebel XTi kit, Canon's compact EF-S 18–55mm f/3.5–5.6 zoom lens approximates a 28–90mm zoom lens (in 35mm format).

These numbers I am referring to are the "Focal Length" and I know Tom understands that.  For those who are not familiar, that is a measurement from where the light "crosses" (as the image turns upside down on the film) to the surface of the film (or imaging sensor on a digital camera).  That distance is the focal length, and it determines if you are zoomed in or wide angle.

If you had a small cardboard box and pushed a nail into the side, so the light entered from that point to expose the film, that is the focal length from the "hole" to the film.  These were called "pinhole" cameras and had no lens at all.   The light "crosses" at that pinhole, and lands upside-down on the film.  Today's camera's do the same thing, but the lens helps to focus the image.

A focal length of 28mm on a 35mm camera produces a traditional wide angle.  35mm refers to the size of the negative, and this site does a good job of explaining how all this works http://www.panoramafactory.com/equiv35/equiv35.html    

A focal length of 50mm was a "normal" lens (what the human eye sees) that was neither zoomed -in, nor wide.  The 105mm is a classic "portrait" lens, it zooms in on the subject.  Sports photography requires powerful zoom lenses, a focal length of say 500 would be zoomed in to the point that it was only looking at only a very small part of the football field.

Bob HarveyUser is Offline
Gold Member
California, Central Coast
Member
Posts:388


12/18/2007 5:02 PM  
Posted By Jud Gardner on 12/18/2007 3:45 PM

My suggestion, get a wide angle lens that will attach to your point and shoot camera which will allow you to take great overall pictures.  This solution will cost between 80-150 bucks.  You'll likely need an adapter. 

I had to do that in 1999, but then wide angle digitals started coming out.   I got one of the first ones (link to Nikon Coolpix 5000) which cost me about $1,000 at the time. It had lot's of issues that they fixed with later models.

I have gone through several digitals since then - if you really look you will find wide angle models that don't need an adaptor these days.

Tom TollUser is Offline
Life Member
Moderator
Member
Posts:916


12/18/2007 6:29 PM  

This is the Digital SLR that I will get after doing reviews and research. Runs about $650.00. There is a good assortment of lenses available.

The Sony á (alpha) DSLR-A100 Digital Camera is a top-quality 10 megapixel Digital SLR Camera that builds on a two-decade legacy of Minolta photographic leadership. It accepts all Minolta A-mount lenses sold worldwide (Maxxum & Dynax), and introduces Sony imaging innovations like high-sensitivity shooting with Super SteadyShot in-camera image stabilization, Dynamic Range Optimizer to automatically increase detail in bright and dark picture areas, Anti-Dust technology to keep the CCD imager clean for better pictures, and Eye-Start Autofocus system for faster camera response. The Sony á (alpha) DSLR-A100 Digital Camera incorporates a large, 10.2 megapixel effective resolution, 23.6x15.8mm APS-C-size CCD imager with Sony's advanced design that allows more light to pass to each pixel, increasing sensitivity and reducing noise, thereby providing greater detail when you make big prints or crop in close on your subject. Product Specification

Key Features
Image Sensor TypeCCD
Resolution10.2 Megapixel
Camera TypeSLR/Professional
Lens
Interchangeable LensWith Interchangeable Lens
Focus RangeVaries With Lens
Macro Focus RangeVaries With Lens
Focal LengthVaries With Lens
Image Quality
Camera Resolution10.2 Megapixel
Image Resolutions1920 x 1280
Exposure Control
White BalanceAuto ? Daylight / Sunny (Preset) ? Cloudy (Preset) ? Fluorescent (Preset) ? Tungsten (Preset) ? Shade (Preset) ? Flash (Preset) ? Colour Temperature Adjust
Storage
Memory TypeCompactFlash Card Type I ? Memory Stick Duo
Compression ModesFine ? Uncompressed
Flash
ISO SpeedsAuto ? 100 ? 200 ? 400 ? 800 ? 1600
Flash TypeBuilt-In
Flash FunctionsAuto Flash ? Rear Sync Flash
Viewfinder / Display
ViewfinderOptical
LCD PanelWith LCD Panel
LCD Screen Resolution230,000 pixels
LCD Protected PositionWithout LCD Protected Position
Interfaces
Interface TypeUSB 2.0
Video InterfaceVideo Out
Power Supply
Battery TypeProprietary Lithium
Included Features
Self Timer2 Sec. ? 10 Sec.
Tripod MountWith Tripod Mount
General
Dimensions (W x D x H)5.2" x 2.8" x 3.7"
Weight1.2 lb.

Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.
GW MocoUser is Offline

Member
Posts:38


12/18/2007 6:48 PM  

Thanks for the input so far, and it looks like you guys have an assortment of experience with cameras. While i am not against a digital camera, my primary goal is to capture the overall view, and my current digital camera will not do this well.

 

Is there a digital camera (not slr) that has a faster recovery time after each shot ? Mine takes approx 3-4 seconds to recover after a shot, not this this matter's adjusting but for outings, events or what ever i would like something with a faster recovery time. Additionally the pixels are not great with my current camera (terrible low light photos) even with flash on. So excluding the slr what is good digital camera that produces clear and blur free photos.

Bob HarveyUser is Offline
Gold Member
California, Central Coast
Member
Posts:388


12/18/2007 7:19 PM  
You are having grief because you get what you paid for - and you have a $130 camera according to your first post.
my primary goal is to capture the overall view, and my current digital camera will not do this well

When you say "overall view" do you mean WIDE view? Do you have the feeling you need to push your back against the wall and step back 5 feet to include more of the room? Or more of the street scene? If so - that is a problem with most digital cameras. See my notes above.  There ARE digitals with a wide angle lens.  If you compare to 35mm film camera lingo, a wide angle is 28mm focal length.  Any wider than that and things get distorted, like a fishbowl.

Additionally the pixels are not great with my current camera (terrible low light photos) even with flash on. So excluding the slr what is good digital camera that produces clear and blur free photos.

I have had 6 digital cameras since 1999 and if you ignore the first 2, any quality digital camera will do great low-light flash.

The old Canon S-60 I am using has a "focus assist beam" which is common with any decent camera these days, always in focus, and it will do great exposures with dim rooms unless they are the size of a commercial building.  I was under a mobile home yesterday, inspecting the fallen insulation, moisture barrier, and 2 prior losses.  Any digital with a focus assist beam will lock in a good focus - you sort of center the view on the spot your flashlight is making, and with the flash it will all come out perfect.  The old S-60 has a wide angle lens.  It is discontinued, you could get one on Ebay but there are newer ones that are a better deal.

The prices keep coming down. The ones I listed above for $250 and below will do more than the ones I paid $1,000 for 5 years ago.

J.R. GibbsUser is Offline

Member
Posts:3


12/18/2007 8:15 PM  
http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Canon-Digital-Rebel-XT-8MP-Digital-SLR-Camera-

You can buy a new Canon Rebel XT that will do everything your wanting. Plus you can buy other lens that will fit the camera like a 28-300 or wide angle lens etc. Myself I shot with Canon 10 D. I have taken alot of pictures in the garage and pit area at Nascar Races and NHRA Drag Racing. Action shots are not a problem, my camera will shoot 3 to 4 pictures per second.
I take alot of motorsport pictures from Nascar to dirt bikes, drag racing etc and sell some pictures except Nascar piictures because Nascar own all copyrights of Photo shot in the pit and garage area. The camera is to large to carry around you neck all the time so when I doing claims I use a Nikon Coolpix and it works grat for me.
Bob HarveyUser is Offline
Gold Member
California, Central Coast
Member
Posts:388


12/18/2007 9:36 PM  
The camera is to large to carry around you neck all the time so when I doing claims I use a Nikon Coolpix and it works great for me.

Yep. I had a Nikon Coolpix that I used from 2002 to 2004, one of the early cameras with a Wide-Angle lens. My current wide angle digital camera was released in 2004, with a great wide-angle lens, and was replaced toward the end of 2005 with the Canon S-80 which also has a wide-angle lens. This link goes to a review, and the final page has a good explanation of wide-angle

...while retaining the versatile 28-100mm optical zoom lens.

...Have you ever found yourself with your back pressed against the wall or corner opposite your subject when shooting indoors? The 3x optical zoom lenses of most consumer digicams have a maximum wide angle focal length in the 35-38mm range, limiting the camera's field of view and making certain interior or landscape shots difficult, if not impossible, to capture. If you value the wide angle end of your camera's zoom range, the S80 is quite worthy of your interest. Its focal length at full wide angle is 28mm, offering plenty of field of view for interiors, group portraits, and landscapes. And shots of your distant subjects won't be compromised; the versatile 3.6x zoom extends to 100mm at the telephoto end of the range.

I just quote this as an example, and I was planning on getting the S-80 when it came out   But another year has passed, and I would opt for the smaller Canon digital Elph SD800 that came out later, with the same wide angle capability.

Always get a spare battery, and rotate them as they are used.  If you want a wide angle digital that uses AA batteries, look at the Nikon Coolpix P50 that goes from 28-102 and it is only $189 at Amazon

GW MocoUser is Offline

Member
Posts:38


12/18/2007 11:40 PM  

Well maybe i am un-coordinated about inspections, but i am leaning toward a mid size camera that will hang around my neck during inspection, though not to bulky or heavy. I carry a camera case on my side, but i am developing an annoyance about pulling it in and out during inspection.

When i exit my truck upon arrival i take, or attempt ot take shots of all of the exterior walls, and then go up top if need be,but i generally have a digital tape in one pocket, a flash light for the interior in the other etc. My inspections or generally on lender placed foreclosures. I do not like to put the camera in the pockets with the other listed items in them, so i tend to remove and replace the camera inside the case on my side, and if not zipped it will fall out especially on the roof if steep, as i will be monkey walking at times LOL. And while inspecting the interior i have the scope pad in a hand and a pen in the other. I walk through the entire interior diagraming, mentally noting damages and then take the photos in the same order.

Though it never fails while taking photos i will see something damaged, or that is of interest that i did not initially see, and have to set the sketch pad and pen aside, reach over and take out the camera and snap. Dont  know why but this makes me feel un-organized and boggled.

So i am thinking that with a mid size camera around the neck, it will be quicker accessed, and i want need both hands to take it out of the case (as pulling on the zipper with one hand) tends to pull the case all at once, hence keeping it from unzipping, therefore i need both hands. Around the neck access i can simply clutch the pad under an arm, pull up the camera and take that sudden shot of interest that was not previously observed.

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