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Last Post 10/01/2010 11:38 AM by  Ray Hall
Is the Independent Adjuster Fast Becoming Obsolete?
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CatAdjusterX
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09/26/2010 10:57 PM
Posted By Ray Hall on 26 Sep 2010 06:12 PM

This is not trying to get rid of cat. adjusters it,s just a more cost effective way of doing what needs to be done, settle losses in a fair manner. This would make cat. adjusting a second job for many, and yearly part time work for many and also give the seekers of good people a smaller; but better pool to select from.

Why do you think vendors love retired militay people, because most of them are excellant adjusters.


Well there you go then, I always thougtht I was destined for CAT adjusting because I was born on the same day that Camille made landfall

(August 18, 1969) along the Gulfcoast, power out , no dr. just a midwife and a few candles for light.
 

Now maybe , just maybe the reason I even got a shot to run with the heavies was because I am in fact retired military and the powers that be took a chance. ( I was medically retired from injuries sustained during Operation Desert Storm Jan. 1991)

 

Robby Robinson

 

"A good leader leads..... ..... but a great leader is followed !!" CatAdjusterX@gmail.com
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Jud G.
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09/28/2010 5:00 PM
Posted By ChuckDeaton on 25 Sep 2010 10:09 AM
Technology will never replace boots on the ground. If anything technology will increase the role of experienced adjusters "experts".
Chuck's statement above needs to be restated in light of its validity; simple and true.  He may have different reasons for coming to this conclusion, but below I describe mine.

I am a daily adjuster and will work a cat if my work is slow and it is a one or two week assignment.  The other condition is if the cat is major and there is a justifiable reason to deploy my large loss team.
 
From my standpoint, I've seen a resurgence of contractor-connection and fast track (cat or daily) programs that eliminate the need to pay an adjuster to work routine, no-nonsense claims.  The daily claims that I continue to see are large losses and those that involve tricky coverage issues.  These scenarios are not the place for a 'profit' minded contractor who is not astute with the policy and coverage issues (or even one that is too versed).  These claims will always require the use of the even tempered, diplomatic adjuster who is skilled in construction, communication, etc. 
 
Catastrophe assignments will continue to decrease proportionately to the amount of useful technology out there.  You tend to see a decrease in contractor connection type assignments, but an uptick of computerized estimates, fast track adjustments, and a reliance on satellite and aerial assistance.  The change here will do the same as in the daily realm- the experienced large loss adjusters who communicate their construction and coverage expertise without binding coverage prior to carrier approval.
 
The team approach is not a novel concept and has been used for years.  The adjuster benefits so they can pave his/her way through the complexities of adjusting the claim.  During this time, his team is deployed to the rather mundane and repitious tasks of collecting data and recording it into a document that we call an estimate.  This is also done by property appraisal firms for homeowner claims whereby chicken scratch scope sheets are emailed along with photographs to the vendor who compiles them into professional reports.
 
As I ruminate over this subject, this is nothing more than the result of a wonderful capitalistic empire that has used the concept of manufacturing at its best.  The ones who will survive are those with the right attitude- willing to learn new tricks.  Chuck's always amazed me at his willingness to be one of the first to try out new technology without being afraid or cynical of the fact the approach may not work.
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linhoch
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09/28/2010 5:06 PM
"In times of change, learners inherit the Earth," wrote philosopher Eric Hoffer, "while the learned find themselves beautifully equipped to deal with a world that no longer exists."

Just happened upon this quote and thought it may be relevant to this thread.
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Jud G.
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09/28/2010 5:16 PM
Posted By CatAdjusterX on 26 Sep 2010 10:57 PM
Posted By Ray Hall on 26 Sep 2010 06:12 PM

This is not trying to get rid of cat. adjusters it,s just a more cost effective way of doing what needs to be done, settle losses in a fair manner. This would make cat. adjusting a second job for many, and yearly part time work for many and also give the seekers of good people a smaller; but better pool to select from.

Why do you think vendors love retired militay people, because most of them are excellant adjusters.


Well there you go then, I always thougtht I was destined for CAT adjusting because I was born on the same day that Camille made landfall

(August 18, 1969) along the Gulfcoast, power out , no dr. just a midwife and a few candles for light.
 

Now maybe , just maybe the reason I even got a shot to run with the heavies was because I am in fact retired military and the powers that be took a chance. ( I was medically retired from injuries sustained during Operation Desert Storm Jan. 1991)

 

Robby Robinson

 
The reason why is because military people have been to boot camp and taught manners; how to take orders when you're tired, how to take orders when you think the superior is an idiot, how to keep working even when you're tired, etc.  This supports my point above about having the right attitude.
 
Cat adjusting does not require unique or technical skills, but having a military or sports background certainly tells recruiters that the prospective employee is likely very well groomed.
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Ray Hall
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09/28/2010 8:30 PM
I meet roofers all the time at the risk. I call the insured and ask for an appointment time that day or the next. 80% state they will have to call me back, that means a door knocker stirred up another wind lift claim. I do a lot of ACV only on roofs over 10 years, but most are pro/rata from date the application shows.
 
I have never met a roofer on wind lift that agreed the shingle   could be resealed by a workman . They are all R &R 100% or the court house. I expect TX. to change their HO coverage in some manner on roofs. I also expect carriers will have to stop sending out 2-3 adjusters, until the roof is totaled. This is bad faith when it had to have 3 adjusters to total out a roof that was a minimum  repair before IKE.
 
No more maximun depreciation of 50%. Thats bad faith in writing
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Jud G.
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09/28/2010 10:04 PM
Ray- what the heck are you talking about?
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ChuckDeaton
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09/28/2010 10:24 PM
Jud, I believe that it is a stated agreement with what your your opinion and mine.
"Prattling on and on about being an ass with experience doesn't make someone experienced. It just makes you an ass." Rod Buvens, Pilot grunt
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catwoman
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09/29/2010 3:26 AM
Posted By Meg on 24 Sep 2010 04:13 PM

The exact (or is that Xact?) Date and time Skynet became self aware was......

 

 

Ah, A fellow Terminator fan. lol 


I'm a sort of closet geek,  ( Please don't tell the "cool" kids)  I love gadgets, However on a higher plane of thinking, I think that technology is ruining not only our industry, but society in general. How many times have you gone through the cashier’s line and found a cashier that cannot count change?  Did you ever notice those pretty pictures on the register keys at Maky Dees? You don’t have to read, just find the burger they want.  Folks don’t have to think for themselves any longer.  Much of their thinking is done for them. We no longer have to learn phone numbers, we don’t have to read the TV Guide, we don’t even have to remember where we put stuff! (BUY! Wireless Electronic Locator”  $62.72 on Amazon)

EyeQ, MSB’s new baby, has lots of bells and whistles like XM8. Look at what its creators are saying  about it:

“We've been saying that it's intuitive; we've been talking about

how, after one six-hour training, new adjusters can go out in the field and

start realizing the benefits of the system.”

 “The other thing that these smart systems do is make up for any knowledge gaps in construction, that can be a result of wither lack of experience or lack of training on the part of the adjuster- to help guide them to things that they might have missed So in the case of removing something from a structure for repair the smart system will guide them to make sure they have actually replace the item, If it notices that there’s an item that has been replaced- say it’s a door- it would also recommend  : you might want to think about a lock set for the door or a doorknob assembly to make sure that the estimate goes out complete”

Source:      http://publishing.yudu.com/Aqbnc/IA...ces/24.htm

Kost goes on to say in this article that this will not eliminate jobs.

 Now, I cannot make a job loss prediction, but I can forecast a “dumbing down” of our industry. Aren’t careless repeated mistakes the only  way that a company can separate the mediocre from the best?  But I forget we now live in a nation where my enthusiasm, hard work and attention to detail, mean nothing anymore, because Jimmy A, Juster will now be able to go to a six hour training program and head out to the field.  

People don’t use their brains anymore; they are becoming robotic in their duties . True story, Happened just yesterday.  We had a young lady scheduling our appts. She scheduled 3 appts on top of one another, no drive time in forget anything.   Common sense is nonexistent anymore.

You know the saying: “Use it or lose it”,   Well get ready world, cause we’ll all be catatonic and drooling on ourselves Needless to say, this young lady is no longer “helping” us.

before between and the last was 180 miles from the 3rd, the span of the day was 9am -3pm, hummm?  She also added a claim that is 316 miles away for 9am the following morning.  Again,hummm?  So I said to my honey, “For goodness sake! Suck it up!  All you need is a Jeannie in a bottle, a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and some Depends, now git after it” lol  He thinks I’m funny.

My point is, this young lady was told to make these appointments, and she knew that we had to inspect the property, write the claim and speak with the insured. She never once considered, distance, drive time, traffic, potty brakes, SLEEP, or a scream passed a drive- thru window for a burger; All  because, no one TOLD her. So it’s not her fault.  She had a task, she did it. See, it’s not her job to think. Someone else has to do that and then put it in a memo and has someone else create a PowerPoint presentation, as well as handouts to post in her cubicle so that she doesn’t

long.

This dear friend is why I shall choose to do things the hard way!

 

 
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catwoman
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09/29/2010 9:11 AM
And this doth prove my point. The copy and paste option, We rely on it too much and just assume it works without checking our work before we post. lol
I will post the correction momentarily.
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catwoman
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09/29/2010 9:22 AM
Reposting:
Ah, A fellow Terminator fan. lol

I'm a sort of closet geek, ( Please don't tell the "cool" kids) I love gadgets, However on a higher plane of thinking, I think that technology is ruining not only our industry, but society in general. How many times have you gone through the cashier’s line and found a cashier that cannot count change? Did you ever notice those pretty pictures on the register keys at Maky Dees? You don’t have to read, just find the burger they want. Folks don’t have to think for themselves any longer. Much of their thinking is done for them. We no longer have to learn phone numbers, we don’t have to read the TV Guide, we don’t even have to remember where we put stuff! (BUY! Wireless Electronic Locator” $62.72 on Amazon)
EyeQ, MSB’s new baby, has lots of bells and whistles like XM8. Look at what its creators are saying about it:
“We've been saying that it's intuitive; we've been talking about
how, after one six-hour training, new adjusters can go out in the field and
start realizing the benefits of the system.”
“The other thing that these smart systems do is make up for any knowledge gaps in construction, that can be a result of wither lack of experience or lack of training on the part of the adjuster- to help guide them to things that they might have missed So in the case of removing something from a structure for repair the smart system will guide them to make sure they have actually replace the item, If it notices that there’s an item that has been replaced- say it’s a door- it would also recommend : you might want to think about a lock set for the door or a doorknob assembly to make sure that the estimate goes out complete”
Source: http://publishing.yudu.com/Aqbnc/IA...ces/24.htm
Kost goes on to say in this article that this will not eliminate jobs.
Now, I cannot make a job loss prediction, but I can forecast a “dumbing down” of our industry. Aren’t careless repeated mistakes the only way that a company can separate the mediocre from the best? But I forget we now live in a nation where my enthusiasm, hard work and attention to detail, mean nothing anymore, because Jimmy A, Juster will now be able to go to a six hour training program and head out to the field.
People don’t use their brains anymore; they are becoming robotic in their duties . True story, Happened just yesterday. We had a young lady scheduling our appts. She scheduled 3 appts on top of one another, no drive time in between and the last was 180 miles from the 3rd, the span of the day was 9am -3pm, hummm? She also added a claim that is 316 miles away for 9am the following morning. Again,hummm? So I said to my honey, “For goodness sake! Suck it up! All you need is a Jeannie in a bottle, a peanut butter and jelly sandwich and some Depends, now git after it” lol He thinks I’m funny.. Common sense is nonexistent anymore.
Needless to say, this young lady is no longer “helping” us.

My point is, this young lady was told to make these appointments, and she knew that we had to inspect the property, write the claim and speak with the insured. She never once considered, distance, drive time, traffic, potty brakes, SLEEP, or a scream passed a drive- thru window for a burger; All because, no one TOLD her. So it’s not her fault. She had a task, she did it. See, it’s not her job to think. Someone else has to do that and then put it in a memo and has someone else create a PowerPoint presentation, as well as handouts to post in her cubicle so that she doesn’t forget anything.
You know the saying: “Use it or lose it”, Well get ready world, cause we’ll all be catatonic and drooling on ourselves before long.
This dear friend is why I shall choose to do things the hard way!
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Goldust
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09/29/2010 9:36 AM
You hit the nail on the head about no common sense any more. I knew several years ago we were in trouble when I was at a high school basketball game and I ordered 3 items from the concession stand. I gave the person a $10 bill and had the change figured up in my head. The Junior in high school person had to do the math 3 times on a calculator then still got it wrong.
   Being my cordial self I stopped by the superintendant and told him about the incident and asked him what kind of math were they teaching these kids. He started off bragging about the new math crap. I told him He needed to institute a mandatory class for all students called common sense.
 
   Since then I believe this new thinking has succeeded in making it into our Federal Government. SAD!!
JERRY TAYLOR
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ChuckDeaton
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09/29/2010 11:28 AM
Man, oh man, I hope "common sense" never reaches this forum! The fun factor will be gone. Adjusters, insureds, the whole insurance industry practicing "common sense" what a thought. That is a concept that will never take holt.
"Prattling on and on about being an ass with experience doesn't make someone experienced. It just makes you an ass." Rod Buvens, Pilot grunt
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catwoman
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09/29/2010 5:21 PM

I have had this happen many times.  I homeschooled my children through a portion of high school so that I could make sure they were able count back change, as well as think for themselves and avoid  falling  prey to the liberal bias indoctrination that is rapidly spreading a  sickness called "victim status mentality"  Or as  I heard someone recently call  it a "Victicract".  

Back to the question; is the IA becoming obsolete? I can only hope that insured’s are as sick of the impersonal business practices that most companies are adopting. Countless times through my day I enter through the gates of someone’s  phone mail hell, a place where a person can easily get lost if they are distracted for a split second and miss the correct prompt or the voice automated dungeon, Where you are  in a heap of trouble as these systems do not seem to understand plain English.  This usually ends with me slowly shouting into the phone like a maniac. I just want to speak to a human please.  If our industry were to send IA's into the black hole of obsolesce, the carriers would have two types of people to deal with; Those who miss the human interaction of a friendly adjuster, who has taken the time to show up at their door with a caring and sincere concern for their loss, willing to listen to the woes that have been thrust upon them and ready answer to questions which otherwise may not have come up in a simple phone conversation. And the other people who just love the fact that no one is coming out to verify their damage, first, why are they so happy about it? I guess it could be an issue of convenience. Or, could it be that many of these people will fall “victim” to the temptation to fudge- just a little.  And hundreds of thousands of little fudges equal billions of dollars in insurance fraud; and that hurts us all, not just the carriers.   And Eagle View, it won't take them long to figure out that you just can't trust technology.  Just this morning we received a EV report it was lovely.  However, they seem to have included a detached garage to the property that is not there, with measurements!  There own photo documentation is father proof that it is not there.  I guess they didn't check that when they created the diagram. Technology is only as good as the person working it.

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Ray Hall
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10/01/2010 10:21 AM
Class Action lawsuits may change the cat. adjusting industry in the future. I don,t know if it will help each one of us make more $ or less. My guess is it will be less$ as all things try to cut outside labor cost. Just read that a class action lawsuit in CA. that required so many care givers in a nursing home was in violation of the law and a large verdict was teturned.
 
Just think about the carriers own adds... We respond... in good hands.... service , service etc.Some of you old timers will remember the October 31 deadline in Florida in 1992 Andrew, when each loss had to be inspected by October 31, 1992. Some adjusters health never recovered from working 20-21 hours per day working for weeks to just do drive by inspections and a poloroid from the driver window of the front of the risk to comply. What would happen if ever roof claim had to bne inspected and settled in 45 days or it was declaired a total loss by the state . It would have to be done by sat. and drive by inspections, OR hire ever roofinnd crew in the USA to get a signed contract ? What would happen if ever child in the USA had to be given a new flu shot. It can,t be done with this manpower and all short cuts will have to be made
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Ray Hall
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10/01/2010 10:55 AM
What would you do if you owned a house that was mortgaged to the hilt of $200,000 and you have not worked for 2 years, but can still just make your mortgage payment. Your mortgage company calls you and says, the will purchase a force placed Homeowners policy on your house for $300,000 the value of your house and it will cost you $1800.00 per year; therefore your mortgage payment is going up $170.00 per month. You look at your budget and see if you cut out this you can get the max of $40.00 new money per month.
 
If you know anyting about insurance coverage and cost like Chuck Deaton and Ray hall , you tell the mortgage company you will send a new new polcy this week for hazard insurance for $200,000.(the amount of the mortgage)
  You go on line and find an a broker and get the rate for a DP1 for the named perils in the DP 1. Fire and lightning, windstorm-hurricane & hail, explosion,riot,civil commotion,smoke,aircraft, land vehicles, and accidental water breaks. for $480.00 per year paid by bank transfer of $45.00 per month.
 
And when it gets down to a lower amount reduce it more, don,t get hooked into this 80% 0f replacemet cost BS. Take some risk youself . Iy you are really bold you can get a 3 year liability polcy as good as your HO section II coverage for about $90.00 for three years. You can buy all the theft coverage most people need for burglary type loss on a house that has no residents at home at the time for $100 per year. Its you $$. this carrier loyality is killing uour good biz. judgement.
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Ray Hall
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10/01/2010 11:28 AM
When was the last time you adjusted a loss on a Homeowners policy on Coverage A or B when a "non compliance with the RCC requirements were not met". I would guess one out of 1,000 readers would say never. I think it had been over 40 years for me. In this downturn we may begin to see it. If I chose to purchase a Homeowners polcy, which I will never do and the carrier would "allow" me to purchase less than 80% of RCC the answer is still no. I would become a person who would not expect more than the ACV on a loss.Being I have some knowledge of adjusting and the "thunb rules" of adjusting I would not even think I was crooked if I only had 50% depreciation on some items. In my heart I would know, but, whats fair is fair, show my yours before I show you mine. I really think the whole Homeowners package policy concept since 1960 when the first one was written is out of control. All bad things that can happen to property can not be insured and never should be.
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Ray Hall
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10/01/2010 11:38 AM
1.Do you think the appointed insurance comish in each state is to keep the carriers in line on the cost of insurance?2. Do you think the comish is the head person in each state to punish ins. carriers for the policyholder. 3 Do you think, wish the rules of the comish overide the carriers coverage decisions?
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