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"How can YOU prove it was not vandals"." I can waterboard the roofer," is my answer to the examiner. Gets a laugh and a file closed.

Ghost,

I did not overlook the criminal aspect at all. You had that in one of your posts. I was bringing up another aspect. While the roofers insurance may  not cover intentional acts or maybe even criminal, if payment is made, the carrier has the right and duty to subrogate and get the money back for the insured as well as the company. As per the loss being less than the ded. Depends on the age of roof and if repairs can be made to that slope. We all have seen roofs in very poor condition where repairs could not be made. May be under the deductible, may not. Even 1 dollar payment is good enough for a subro act and we used to enjoy going after contractors who acted the way some of these guys do. Besides, after the first letter it was sent to the subro department and they took it from there. Never say never...Just take good pictures of the roofer tearing the roof up as they may be needed for either the criminal or civil actions.

On something like what has been described, it would fall to the carrier to decide what to do unless you are the staff person out there.

Is it considered "bad faith" to not meet with the roofer? I normally set the appointment with the homeowner for a general time slot and leave it up to them if they want the roofer to show up. I also tell them that unless this is the company that will be doing the work then there is no reason to meet. If the roofer is at the appointment, I will give him a few minutes to do a quick walk around to point out damages and then politely ask him to leave me alone so I can do my job. Sometimes they do point out important things such as metric shingles, impact resistive shingles, comp over wood, ice and water shield etc. However, if they start arguing or become confrontational over the call then explain to the homeowner that you allowed the roofer to make his case but now it is time to ask him to leave or wait in the truck in order that you can accurately scope the loss. This process does not take long especially if they start claiming lifted shingles for wind damage or granular loss and nail pops as hail damage!

Chuck about 25 years ago a very large fire restoration company in Houston closed its foors and left town after an employee set a Baytown school fire to get some work during slow times. I will not say much more on this matter.  also knew several staff adjusters get fired that had dealings with this contrator. It happens, but many carriers are gutless. I have had some cases, but the carrier would not let me use the water board. An IA has to be very carefull in these cases. You may become toxic from the mess" and never get back to where you were before".

Posted By Ray Hall on 31 Mar 2010 11:08 AM

Chuck about 25 years ago a very large fire restoration company in Houston closed its foors and left town after an employee set a Baytown school fire to get some work during slow times. I will not say much more on this matter.  also knew several staff adjusters get fired that had dealings with this contrator. It happens, but many carriers are gutless. I have had some cases, but the carrier would not let me use the water board. An IA has to be very careful in these cases. You may become toxic from the mess" and never get back to where you were before". "that,s why we get some of these stinkers"

what language was that? English please for us undergrads.

I am going to start a new topic: Roofer -Insurer SIU Partnership. Why not a partnership?  If I had to choose between reporting a scumbag insured for insurance fraud, helping the insurer get restitution, and possibly get paid a percentage if not most of the RCV money to do my roof job I would gladly do that instead of just putting a mechanic's lien on a home and hoping to get paid.  Here is an idea that I am considering putting on my contracts:

Warning: Insurance fraud is a felony and I report all homeowners that commit insurance fraud to the insurance company and help them prosecute.  Instead of me simply placing a mechanic's  lien on your property;  I will contact your insurer and inform them that you were able to get your repairs done for the ACV money and that the RCV money amounts to profitting from your loss. Which is excluded by your insurance carrier.  You must refund your RCV money to your insurer or face insurance fraud prosecution.

I think this is a great idea!  I would gladly help put some piece of garbage that ripped me off and the insurance company off in jail.  I would love to hear replies on this idea!

The aftermath of a large hurricane in a very large area like hurricane IKE has changed the role of the first adjuster who contacts the insured and writes the FIRST excepted estimate(in the opine of the carrier) A new area of cat. adjusting has started. The law firms take any disputed claim and promise"possibly thousands more, at no cost".

How is this possible to get thousands more at no cost? This is how it plays out for years after the first wave have gone home and it works. The policy holders do get thousands more, WITHOUT having a jury trial. The filed suits have a less than .001% of ever being tried to conclusion. They all settle some day for a big price. This is the problem, they all should be tried before a jury and this would stop the cycle. Cat. adjusters will now have to document ever conversation in detail, with great photos, diagrams and the best little estimate Mr. xmate can crank out with the author having the imagination of the president of the public adjusters assoc. on his first LSD trip.

I agree with you Rocke, this is the only thing that will stop blackmail before trail. Looser pays the cost. I tried a comparitive negligence in federal court in Casper  Wyo. in 2003. My wife was the passenger in my car when I lost control and was hit in a black ice case in the right door. She   still has pain 15 years later and always will.

We lost the case, got a zero. The jury did not like us. Storm troopers.....surprise.